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Whether you join us in the morning or at night, there's nothing better than a sober sunrise. We hope that you enjoy today's speaker. >> What's up, guys?

>> Hey. Hey. I'm Charlie Parker, alcoholic.

>> Man, what a fine looking crew. Well, that's that's fine. Yeah.

>> Acknowledge your height. >> Yeah. Thank you.

Let me turn this thing on. I set a timer to give the newcomers hope. I tell you that fire is uh it is on me.

I mean I uh Okay. Uh boy, welcome. I just I'm really excited about this weekend.

I uh I've been hanging out with Bill for the last couple of days. I Let me get some of the housekeeping out of the way, though. Charlie Parker, alcoholic.

My sobriety date is March 22nd of 1985. And for that, I am truly grateful. And uh and I I do have 5 days more than Bill Cleveland.

So, uh you know, I'm not going to make a big I'm not going to make a big deal out of it because I I live in an abusive household where my my wife has 5 and 1/2 months more than I do and and and thinks it's a really big deal. I uh when we get in an argument, sometimes she'll say, "Honey, just stick around for about five and a half months." it'll be much more clear to you, you know. But I uh um my home group is the primary purpose group of Alcoholics Anonymous in Austin, Texas.

And uh we are a big book uh study group. We meet once a week on Tuesday nights at 7:30. If you're ever in Austin on a Tuesday night, uh come see us.

We'd love to show you the same kind of hospitality you've been showing me since I got here. And uh but we study the big book line by line, week after week, and it's just a lot more fun than it sounds like. You know, I there was there was a time when I would have been like, "Oh boy." Um you know, uh but it really is we have about 225 people on a Tuesday night studying the Big Book in in our little town.

And just it tells me that I I think real alcoholics are hungry for real solution. And um but um Bill picked me up at the airport yesterday. I've been hanging out with him and Zach and then we picked up Ryan today and I've been and Bill's a good friend and him and Karen were just he just talked in Austin at our big citywide meeting and uh he stayed at the house and then uh so him and Karen and Katie I uh my wife is Katie and she sends her regards and I'm just I'm I'm not worth a flip without her.

I tell you I didn't bring a tie. I uh the last time we were not together, I took uh two left shoes from different pairs of shoes with me. That was interesting.

I uh but um there was a time when I wouldn't have been real fired up about a big book study meeting and I'm going to talk about that tonight. I it's real important for me to tell you that that I'm not like I didn't come over from Texas to straighten anybody out or, you know, not sent down from headquarters to tell you how you're killing people or anything, you know. I just I mean that's always a real effective message, you know.

Oh, so glad you dropped by, you know, I mean, had had you not come by, we would have just continued killing people, you know. I uh um but my I am I am a big book guy. I call myself an unapologetic big book thumper.

And uh and and the reason we I say that is cuz it it's just I've I've I've been around AA for 28 years. I've been I've been a sober member of Alcoholics Anonymous half my life and I'm 57 years old and um I've done it a lot of different ways and there's a lot of times where I've been a good example of a bad example and and and I've worked this program by hanging around the fellowship and I've worked it um coming out of the big book and my results have just been a lot better the time that I followed the clear-cut directions out of the book and that and that's we're going to talk about that quite a bit this weekend cuz but tonight I'm just basically going to tell my story. And uh but I want to thank anybody that had anything to do with putting this thing on.

I mean, I know Jeff and Scott and and Franklin and those guys. I mean, if if you've been around a if you've ever been involved in one of these deals, you know, there's a lot of people that do a lot of work to get something like this to come together. I just want to I want to thank and if it's anything like the the groups at home, there's also a whole bunch of us that didn't do a darn thing.

Uh but we have some ideas about how it could have been done just a little bit better. You know, that's the fellowship I crave. You know, I uh I don't know.

Um, I just can't wait to hear what we're going to talk about this weekend. I uh um you know, I I I like I like to start off get a little jumpy, you know? I mean, get and before and I don't know who's jump here, me or Bill, because we've been hanging out for two days.

And for the last two days, every time I'd tell a story, they just seemed like they were going down and down. And at one point, he goes, "I'm really not sure this is a good idea." You know, I was we were really hoping for somebody a little more spiritual. And I was like, I'm going to get spiritual any minute.

I swear. But but the jokes just keep coming, you know. And um but I like to start off with a joke just to get warmed up and and and you because in you know in AA we're talking especially telling my story.

I'm going to talk about my my experience from my viewpoint. You know I hear people say you know that we're not going to give you any personal opinion. I'm going to be giving some opinions.

You know, I mean, there's some stuff I don't know how else to do it other than um than some of my opinions are going to show up, but we talk about coming out of our own experience. You know, it says, you know, we're going to talk about what I used to be like, what happened, and what I'm like now. And, you know, when I talk about coming out of my own experience, it always reminds me of this joke about this guy that's driving down a little farm road in Texas one day and he sees a sign on this fence post and it says, "Talking dog for sale.

and he can't he can't stand it. He goes up to the farmhouse and he says, "So, you got a talking dog for sale?" Guy says, "Yeah, he's around back." And uh he wanders around back and there's this red hound dog laying there by the porch and he he walks up to the dog and he says, "So, you can talk?" The dog says, "Well, I certainly can." And he goes, "How in the world did that happen?" And he goes, "Well, it's it's an interesting story." He says, "When I was young, I started picking up uh some speaking skills. And as I got older, I started developing some of the nuances of the language.

I started picking up slang and local dialects and that sort of thing. It's made for a fascinating life. He said, "I had a 19-year career with the Drug Enforcement Administration, and I was able to infiltrate some situations that no human agent would have ever been able to get into.

And and I've eaten in some of the world's finest restaurants, cooking from the finest chefs. I've stayed in some of the best hotels in the world." He says, "But enough about me. The really interesting part, some of my pups have developed foreign language skills and have become international diplomats and I have two pups that are in the United Nations right now and uh it's just all in all it's been an amazing life.

And the guy says, "God, it's just been fascinating talking to you." And he goes back up front where that uh farmer sitting there and he goes, "How much do you want for a dog like that?" And the guy goes, "I don't know, 40 bucks." And he goes, "Why would you ever sell a fascinating dog like that for $40?" And the guy goes, "None of that crap he told you is true." So, it's kind of like that around here. It doesn't really matter how good the story is if it's if it's not my experience. But I I uh I'm going to put that where I swear I've I've had a flamethrower at my ass before, but never quite like this.

You know, I uh Yeah, somebody built a fine fire, I tell you. Get a merit badge for that. I uh I don't know.

Let's see. Let's get going. I um let me see.

I had a SC. Let me just Okay, let's get drinking. I uh I grew up in Dallas, Texas.

I live in Austin, Texas. Now, it's 200 miles south of Dallas. And uh uh but I grew up in Dallas.

And I come from a a pretty normal household. I mean, I I I I didn't Nobody was drinking. I come from a long line of Southern Baptists, you know, and and I don't know what they were saying in that Baptist church, but what I was hearing was, "God loves you, but you're going to burn in hell, you know, and and uh it was it wasn't really encouraging, but I uh but my mother was a school teacher, my father was a salesman, my my mother taught first grade for 42 years.

I was darn well prepared for the first grade. I mean, kind of kicked it pretty good, you know, all the way up to like fifth grade. But I uh I grew up in a pretty normal household.

I mean, I don't know exactly what normal is, but I've heard enough fifth steps over the years to know that a lot of people had it a lot worse than I did growing up. I mean, I came from a pretty functional household. Um, I had a sister that was perfect who's 5 and a half years older than I am and just all everything, you know, first chair, floutist, drum majorette, national honor society, Dell High Symphony, Orchestra, and then there's this kind of thuggish little brother and and uh, but you know, my mother was a teacher and education and intelligence was everything.

And uh, and there was a lot of talk about IQ and potential. And I grew up, anybody else grew up under the burden of potential? Oh my god.

I mean, it was like, you know, why can't you live up to your potential? Why can't you be more like, you know, the kid across the street? And I remember thinking, you know, that's flattering, mom, but I'm really not holding back that much, you know?

I mean, you're kind you're kind of getting my best shot here, you know. But um but but I uh I will say that 12 years of heavy drinking and and extensive use of outside issues will significantly lower people's expectations of you, you know? I mean, by the by the time I got here, it was like just get a job, you know?

I mean, for forget about a career or a profession, just get off the couch. And uh you know, but I mean I didn't start drinking. I think I drank at about 13.

I got really drunk. I remember an episode that had a bottle of Cuddy involved uh at a motel in Waco and but I didn't really start drinking until I was 16. Um I u and but ever since then, I mean, the first time I really got good and loaded, I remember thinking, "Oh, we're going to do this a lot." you know, I mean, something significant happened the first time I got loaded.

And what I didn't know then was that from that date till I came into, hey, drinking and getting loaded moved to the center of my life. And and anything that interfered with that was going to get moved out of the way. I didn't I never said that out loud, but looking back, that was the deal.

If anything got in between me and getting loaded, it was going to move out of the way. And this, you know, it's not everybody's story in AA. I I but I mean it'd be real macho to stand up here and tell you that I drank a fifth of whiskey every day from that time till I sobered up.

That wouldn't be true. But what it is true for me, I don't know, it's not everybody's NA story, but for me, from the time I was 16 until the time I came into AA at the age of 28, I never turned down the opportunity to get loaded one time under any circumstances for any reason. There was never one A lot of people had it together a lot better than I did.

I was all about getting loaded at every opportunity. There was never a time in my memory where, you know, somebody would pull something out and I'd go, "Oh, uh man, you know, it's my mom's birthday today." Or or anything like that. It was it would it would the obsession was on and I and I would never turn it down.

and and I you know and I ran that way for a long time. I um I'm a big believer in AA's primary purpose and singleness of purpose and and I talked some about that. I don't I try not you know in an AI environment I don't talk about outside issues.

Sometimes I'll mention outside issues or additional issues or whatever the case may be. But you know and and re the reason for that and a lot of people we didn't talk about singleness of purpose a lot when I was coming up in AA you know and and I never really understood it. In fact, I came in when there was a big fight at this AA club in Austin and they were saying, you know, they won't let you talk about dope over at the Northland group.

And we were all like, well, you know, dope's part of my story, you know, and and I'll talk about whatever, you know, I want and I never really thought about that. There's some parts of my fifth step that were uh also part of my story that I didn't feel quite as compelled to talk about. But uh just saying but but the whole thing behind it, nobody was talking about singleness of purpose, you know, and and I mean and we're going to we'll talk about it some weekend.

I I should tell you before I get too far into this deal that I got some pretty righteous ADD working up here and and there will be times in my talk when I'll say we'll get back to that later or um and what that means is that this is not the right time to introduce that chunk of information into the talk. But when I tell you we're going to get back to it later, we're probably not coming back, you know. I always get real excited when I actually circle back around to one, you know, I go off on little bunny trails and and and stuff.

But but you know, singleness of purpose, the the short version of it is that AA is about alcoholics working with alcoholics and and it's we're kind of a onetrick pony in AA. It's a it's a pretty solid trick, but it's most effective when it's drunks working with drugs. And and the thing I never really understood about that is it the reason that is is this identification that takes place when one drunk is talking to another one.

And you know you remember the first time you felt it when you came when I came into AA the first time I'd been around people that understood why I get so loaded and knew why I get loaded and they'd quit and they seemed happy about it. And there there's an identification that takes place and it's mentioned on uh page 18 in our book where it says um it talks about how we will we got to be the only group of people that will go to a psychiatrist and pay them $200 an hour and lie to them the whole time. You know, I mean, if they say, "Do you drink?" I mean, I'm not going to go, "Yeah, I like to get a case of beer and a half gallon of vodka in the mornings and just see what the day brings after that." you know, I mean, I'm going to I'm going to say, you know, maybe a couple of beers if I'm mowing a yard or something, you know, like like I've mowed the yard lately, you know.

I mean, but but it's it goes on to say, "Wives, parents, and intimate friends seem find us more unapproachable than do the the psychiatrist and the doctor." But here's where it gets interesting. It says, "But the ex-pro drinker who has found this solution who's properly armed with the facts about himself can generally win the entire confidence of another alcoholic in a few hours." And there's what the key line is right here. It says, "Until such an understanding is reached, little or nothing can be accomplished." So, what did it say?

It's saying, "Until that understanding is reached, we're really not going anywhere." I mean, you know, there's something that happens and and it's funny. My wife and I are both My wife's I told you she's got 29 years. I got 28.

But we both get are very fortunate. We get to go around to a lot of conferences and stuff. And one of my favorite little games that we play is wherever we're going, they'll usually send somebody to come pick you up and you know, and you're talking to the guy and you know, and Scott says, "Hey, I'm going to come pick you up at the airport." And I and he, you know, he'll they'll always go, "I'm about five." And don't even tell me.

Don't even tell me. just be in baggage claim. It's a little thing I like to do and it's this identification, you know, and I can't tell you how many times I've come down the escalator and you come down into the baggage claim area and you look around and you go, "There's our boy right there." And you know, you know, and and you walk over there and go, "Are you Scott?" And he goes, "Yeah, yeah.

How'd you know?" And you're like, you know, I mean that and you know that identification is so important that out of out of all the 12step programs that are out there, and there's a billion of them. I mean, there's alcoholics synonymous, narcotics anonymous, gamblers anonymous, overeaters. I even heard there's a lip balm addict synonymous.

In case anybody's ever suffered from that heartbreaking malady, you know, I swear every time you say that, you see one guy with his carax going, "Oh, I feel you, buddy. I know." Um, but out of all those 12step programs, the only difference in any of them is the first half of the first step and the and the middle part of the of the 12step. What I'm powerless over and who I carry the message to.

You know, that identification is that important. So, you know, I I sponsor a lot of guys and you hopefully you'll never hear any of them say in a meeting, I'm an alcoholic and uh anything because it it doesn't matter. you know, saying that I'm an alcoholic and an addict would be like saying I'm an alcoholic and a contractor or an alcoholic and a Texan or whatever it is because, you know, in that AA meeting, what we're identifying as is alcoholics, just like if I go to a CA meeting, I would identify as a cocaine addict or something like that.

And I never heard anybody breaking that down much for me. But but for the bulk of the weekend, I'll talk about I will say the shortest version of my story. And I I don't have enough time to talk a whole lot about my story.

There's some really funny episodes that happened. And we were talking about some of them over at Bill's house last night. And I mean, some of that stuff's just funny, you know?

I mean, but uh the shortest version of my story is that the guys that I drank with thought that I did way too much outside issues. And the guys that I used with were shocked by my drinking, you know. So, I mean, so everybody thought I was getting a little too loaded, you know.

There wasn't anybody surprised when I wound up in AA. There wasn't anybody going, "Really? I never even knew you had a problem, you know.

I mean, it's just like, "Oh, thank God." You know, I mean, listen to what those people say, you know. But um I started using it about 16 and I really didn't need you guys until I was about 17 probably. I uh I was uh I was it was pretty ragged pretty fast.

But there was some years you know the book talk all this is I'm going to be working out of this and all this is here my sponsor owns a book bindary. Uh my sponsor is Myers R in uh Dallas and and uh before he passed away, my sponsor was Mark Houston and um um but Myers just took a large print copy of the big book and took the stories out of the bag. But all this is is a large print copy of the AA big book and u I work a lot out of this book.

This is one of my most prized possessions and and you know and after hearing so much stuff in the discussion meetings for a while, it's nice to go back and reference. some of this stuff because right there on the title page is the first promise in the big book and I didn't missed it for a long time. It says the story of how many thousands of men and women have recovered from alcoholism.

And there was a time in my sobriety when you when I would if somebody said they were recovered alcoholic, I'd have been like, man, you better not say that, you know? I mean, you'll it's like walking under a ladder or something, you know? You'll be you'll be drunk by sundown if you say you're recovered, you know.

But what are we talking about having recovered from? And we'll talk about that a lot in the in the morning uh when we talk about the first step. But the way it rolled out for me was it worked really well for a while.

The alcohol brought about a change in me that was really welcome. I've been needing a drink a long time before I ever got my hands on one. And first time I And from the moment I started doing it, it was like I I mean I was all about it.

And uh it started getting kind of sloppy. Um you know the book talks about how we we start losing the power of choice and control. Uh on page 24 it says something really interesting.

It says we pass into a state where the most powerful desire to stop drinking is of no avail. Always found that interesting. You know that a desire to stop drinking will get me a front row seat in any AA meeting.

But right there on page 24, it tells me it won't do a darn thing to keep me sober. It says I pass into a state where the most powerful desire to stop drinking is is of absolutely no avail. And it goes on to say that at certain times I can't bring into my consciousness was sufficient force the memory of the suffering and humiliation of even a week or a month ago when I started off drinking.

I mean things were going good. I I liked it. I was running with some guys that we were doing a lot of uh import export business and uh money was flowing and you know we had the jetboats and cars and color TVs and motorcycles and you know you couldn't tell me anything and and it started running a little sloppy and I start and I noticed I got a little more loaded than most of those guys did.

Uh but um like one night I was a blackout drinker. Any other blackout drinkers here tonight? I mean, I didn't I mean, I just thought you were supposed to, you know, I mean, I was I was drinking for oblivion every day, you know, and and I blacked out several times a week.

I was kind of proud of my driving. I mean, if you only have if you're blacking out three or four times a week and you only have a wreck every few months, I mean, I thought I thought I was doing pretty good, you know. Um, but there's a lot of crash sites I can point out around Dallas.

You know, where I hit that tree or I ran into a lady here, and there's some more of those stories that are really funny, but we just don't have time to tell them. But one night, I left this bar in a blackout uh in Dallas. And uh I was I was I should tell you that I was driving my mother's car.

I was uh I was so poorly treated as a child that I uh I ran away from home for good at the age of 28. I'm I'm serious. Never went back, you know.

I uh but I left this bar in her car in her her car one night and uh and the way I came out of the blackout was I there'd been a collision and and it was one of those nights where my field of vision was only about that big. And everything out here was real fuzzy. I can see a fender sticking up in the air and but I'm rolling and I keep my foot on the gas and we and I go down the street and I pull the car around the corner and for some reason my shoes were over in the passenger floorboard.

I didn't have my shoes on and I I remember when I grabbed my shoes and I go running back I'm going to run back to the bar to report the car stolen and uh and and it's important to say this was not an extraordinary night. you know, this is just kind of me doing my deal the way and and but I'm going to I'm I'm going to run back and report the cars throwing. And as I'm running back to the to the bar, I'm running under these trees with my shoes in my hand and I look over and uh there's two cops and they got those big flashlights and they're shining them down like this and there's twinkling glass all in the street.

And as I'm running along, I remember thinking, man, they got here fast, you know? And and uh so I go back and I report the car stolen. The next morning they said, "Mr.

Parker, you're going to have to take a polygraph test to pick your car up." And I said, "Well, why is that?" And they said, "Well, it was involved in an accident before it was reported stolen." And I said, "You're kidding." And they said, "No, uh they ran into a parked police car." And I remember thinking that explains how they got here so fast, you know, cuz I'd been really fuzzy on that one, you know, and and I mean, and you know, Norm Al Malp used to talk about seconds and inches about how our lives were saved and changed by seconds and inches. And I got a dozens of stories like that where um if things if those two cops had happened to been standing there that night, uh you might have a different speaker up here tonight. But I uh but it started going, you know, but I'd shake that off and I keep moving and and uh another thing when it start I started losing the power of choice and control.

I didn't really understand what was happening. And uh a lot of this stuff I usually talk about when we're talking about step one, but and we may cover some step one tonight and then we can move a little further tomorrow. But but the book spends the doctor's opinion.

You know, our whole recovery program is in the first 103 pages of the book really. I mean, the doctor's opinion, the first 103 pages, the back chapters are very important, but they're like, you know, to wives, uh working with others. No, no, I'm sorry.

to wives, family afterwards, to employers, and a vision for you. So, the bulk of our recovery program is in those first 103 pages on the doctor's opinion, and they spend almost half of that talking about step one cuz uh and I think I'm going to save that for in the morning. This is a tightly run machine up here, you know.

Uh but I but I can't help but talk about it a little bit tonight because I didn't really realize what was going on and I didn't realize that I was losing the power of choice and control and and what happened. I was I be I was a big fan of pawn shops. Anybody any other pawn shoppers here tonight?

My people. You know I uh I loved everything about the pawn shops. I mean because there was there was a purity of the equation that really appealed to me.

I mean I mean you know cuz now I didn't own I should tell you up front before I forget to say it that I didn't own very much stuff. So I was having to pawn stuff that didn't belong to me and and that adds a little heat to the equation. But you know we drunks we drunks make some brilliant plans.

I mean, and we'll make a plan, you know, that you could write it down and show it to somebody over at Pepperdine over here, and they, you know, they look it over and go, that's pretty solid plan, you know, and and my plans worked right up till they quit working. And, you know, and and the plan with the pawn shops was that you had 90 days to get everything back. And the thing I loved about pawn shops is there was no shame.

There was no I mean I don't ever remember walking in a pawn shop and them going good god man uh what are you gonna do with this money you know or weren't you just in here this morning or or something like that you know it was just give them the shotgun and they give you the money and you give them the deer rifle and they give you the money and I had 90 days to get everything out and I could usually pull some kind of a scam or deal or something during that 90 days to get and keep that ball rolling and like so many of my plans it worked right up until it quit working, you know. And one night I came I went I did a deal one time that netted enough money to get everything out of the pawn shops. And I uh um but I stopped by the Spillway Pub there in Northeast Dallas.

I said, "I'm just going to settle my tab. I'm not going to trigger the phenomenon of craving or anything, you know. I'm just going to go in and settle my tab and maybe but I got a lot of ground to cover cuz I got to go to all these pawn shops." And uh I came out of a five-day blackout.

I didn't have many of those. I had a lot of those overnight blackouts where you're not sure what happened or where you were or where the car is and that sort of thing. But this was 5 days of I don't remember nothing.

And uh oh, there's some funny stories that came out of that one, but most of them involve outside issues. I uh one little short one. This guy called me up.

This guy called me up after that. He goes, "Hey, I got some more of that Chinese outside issue." And uh and I said, "I've never done any Chinese stuff." And he goes, "Oh, dude, you've done a lot of Chinese stuff, you know." And I was like, "God didn't remember it, you know, but I uh I come out of this blackout and I had $8 I'm sitting on the edge of the bed at my mother's house and I had I'll never forget it. I had I can tell you where I was sitting, which way I was facing, the temperature of the room because when I came out of that, I woke up and I had $8 in this pocket and in this pocket I still had all those pawn tickets.

I had gotten a darn thing out of the pawn shop and it was one of those mornings where you just go, "Oh no." Cuz I shot my wad on that deal I just did and now I got nothing. And my dad was a good man. My dad worked hard for his stuff.

There wasn't anybody um giving him his stuff. And I'm out there pawning. And I wasn't a sociopath.

I knew that was some bad BS. And I couldn't just let his deer rifle go to the pawn broker for 40 bucks or whatever it was, you know? So I'd have to I'd have to go to my father and say, "Dad, listen.

If we act now, I can get you a pretty good deal on all your stuff, you know, but but if we wait till tomorrow, it's strictly retail, you know, and and the reason I mean, I almost have to tell that I should also tell you that I'm I'm a big guy, ride Harley's, I'm a competitive shotgun shooter, I do a lot of other stuff. I'm liable to cry like a little girl in a pink dress up here at just about any moment. And one of the times is when I remember the desperation of those mornings, you know, but I almost have to tell that like it's a joke because I mean because what would happen next is wasn't Dallas is a big spread out town like like LA is.

And it wasn't just we're going to go to the pawn shop. is like we got to go over on Buckner Boulevard and get your deer rifle and your shotguns out on Beltline Road and the metal detectors are out in Oak Cliff and your coin collections in Garland and we got to go, you know, to Harry Hind to pick up, you know, the sterling silver. And so it was all day in the car with me and my dad and all that shame.

And when we'd be riding around, I'd be going, "Dad, I swear to God, I will never do this again." And if I was lying to that man, I damn sure didn't know it because it felt like I meant it with every fiber of my being that I will never do this again. What I didn't know riding in the truck with my dad that day is that I didn't have the power to make good on that promise. When I was promising him that I was never going to do that again, I might as well have promised him that I was going to flap my arms up here and fly around the room because I did not have the power to never do that again.

Within 24, 48, 72 hours, I'd hit the back door of my dad's house like a cat burglar. And it would just be like coming in there and just going that. And then off we go.

And my father and I made the round to the pawn shop three times before I found my way to you people. That's how cool I was. That's how slick I was.

Is that I I couldn't keep anything together and I was a burden to anybody that was unfortunate enough to love or care about me. That's that's what I brought to you people. And uh about that time I'd moved to Austin to go to school and really completely driven by a student loan.

I saw a piece of paper that said student loans reactivated. I applied and I got the money and next thing you know I'm a college student, you know, cuz it was go to work student loan, take it. And uh and so I I'm down in Austin and uh um I started getting in in a lot of trouble, but um by this time I'm starting to pick up charges, you know, and and starting to look sloppy on paper, you know, and I'm picking up charges while I've got pending charges and and and that sort of thing.

and um and uh I picked up a forgery case and uh and a 100 mph DWI, but um there was this maintenance guy in my apartments that would well I should say my apartments. There was some people let me lay up in their apartment and and and um and and uh this guy kept coming in talking about treatment, the mainst uh like any good college student. And uh and he kept talking about treatment.

I don't know why he thought we wanted to hear anything about it. You know, he never talked about detox. He never talked about AA.

He just talked about treatment. And I'll never forget at one point he said, "You might want to go pull a really good drunk before you go to treatment because they're going to make you not want to drink anymore." And I remember thinking, "I'm on it." You know, and that really good drunk took nine months. Uh for 9 months, I was uh I was fixing to go to treatment.

That's a Texas term. I don't know if they say fixing out here, but it doesn't mean repairing. It means preparing.

You know that I was I was about to go to treatment for 9 months. And and that whole time, you know, I mean, next week is a good time to go to treatment, you know. I mean, you know, and and sometimes u when things were really bad, by God, I'm going to go tomorrow, you know.

I mean, probably probably tomorrow afternoon. But uh but but when tomorrow get here, it was never it was always today and today was never the day, you know, until it was till that day when I couldn't go another day. And uh so I wound up checking myself into that treatment center he talked about.

And I' I've got to move pretty fast because I've had two experience, two very distinct experiences in AI. and and and I had my biggest spiritual awakening uh when I'd been sober 17 years. And uh what happened in that first pass through the steps, I got a sponsor who I love till the day he dies.

I mean, this guy was a huge part of my life. And he taught me a lot about character and discipline and uh foreign concepts like honesty and doing what you said you were going to do if for no other reason than because you said you were going to do it. Is that is that kind of twisted?

You know, I mean, he made me buy a pickup truck one time from a guy because I told the guy I was going to buy it. I found a better deal, but he's like, "Did you tell the guy you were going to come buy the truck?" And I was like, you know, you can see it coming already. You know, I'm like, "Technically, yes." You know, and he's like, "Well, then go buy the truck.

I drove that truck with a resentment for a year and a half." But, but he wasn't a real step technician, you know. In fact, I like to say that and we thought we were we thought we were into the big book. My home group was a Tuesday night big book study meeting.

I went to three Joe and Charlie big book studies and um but I missed an awful lot. Mark Houston used to like to say, "How do you know what you don't know?" And and I I I missed a lot of stuff in those first pass through the steps. And I mean, I like to but I'm a firm believer in sponsorship.

And I always say, don't wait till you're perfect to do it because I it's my firm belief that if the sponsor and the sponsor are both giving it their best shot, God takes up a lot of slack in that deal, you know, and both people were, you know, moved towards the solution. But I we went through the steps and and but the kind of the way we went we went through it was are you alcoholic? And I said yes.

I mean, clearly I must be. If there is such a thing as an alcoholic, I must be one. And I didn't know anybody that drank more than I did.

So, um, you and I've been walking around saying I was alcoholic for a long time. Didn't really know what it meant. And we're going to talk about that some in the morning, but maybe do you Yeah, we'll get back to that.

But and then do you believe in this power? I had a little struggle with the power, you know, and we had to talk about that a little bit because I'd had a lot of problems growing up in church and and that sort of thing. I punched my dad.

The book talks about some of us were violently anti-religious. I punched my father in the nose one Sunday morning over whether or not I was going to go to Sunday school that morning. I think that qualifies as violently anti- relligious, you know, but and my dad was about Bill size.

You know, it was a really ugly Sunday morning for me, but I didn't go to Sunday school and and and didn't for a long time after that. But, you know, do you believe in this power? And then we went right from do if you said yeah maybe we went right from that to then let's get on our knees and do the third step prayer and and get you right an inventory and and I wrote in and you know and if you do that and this is definitely what I like to talk about in a workshop I love workshop environments because you really get a chance to go through what my second experience was with the steps but I think what happens with a lot of us is we go right from are you willing to believe to the third step prayer.

And if we if I do that, I skip this body of work that takes place in pages 60, 61, 62, and 63. And it's it's really not very important. We'll talk about it tomorrow.

It's just the root of my problem and the basis of my recovery for the rest of my life, you know. Other than that, skip it, you know. But so I wound up I did that and I'm writing the inventory and and and so see if this sounds a little selfish.

My take on the steps then was that I'm I'm alcoholic and that's a problem. Can God help me? I hope so.

Okay, three. Let's do the third step prayer and then we're going to write inventory. I'm going to talk about all the bad stuff that I've ever done because then I won't feel as bad and I won't have to drink.

And then uh I'll do a fifth step with somebody and and it's just going to be like a big it was like a big confession kind of. and and then I'll feel better. And and and then six and seven, you just kind of phone those in.

And and uh and then and eight and nine go out and make amends so that uh I won't run into anybody that makes me feel bad or I won't feel bad about, you know, and and and then 10 and 11, I knew to apologize if I really screwed up. Uh, and and I would do some, but the bulk of my meditation was kind of keeping the 24-hour a day book on the back of the toilet and uh, you know, reading it and going, you might as well go, "Okay, God, see you tomorrow." You know, and and and and then I was I was carrying that message, you know, to people. But I was very much about staying sober.

I was very much an AA member. I was a fellowship making fool. I mean, I'm I'm going to meetings all the time and I'm dating AA girls and and AA roommates and going to AA barbecues and AA dances and that sort of thing.

And uh um I talk a lot about untreated alcoholism and I hit a bottom at 4 and 1/2 years sober and I hit a bottom, you know, blew up a marriage, had a child support check going out and all these are things that are against my values. uh I didn't get married to to get divorced and and you know I really wanted to raise that little girl and and uh you know things are starting to get ugly in sobriety and then I I waited the appropriate amount of time to get into another relationship 14 days and uh and and and and so two and a half years later I've blown up another marriage and got another child support check going on and what what happened for me and by this time I got some things going Um, and uh, this is not a period of my life that I would have wanted videotaped and sent into the general service office on how a 7-year member of Alcoholics Anonymous would would behave. But I got into I was getting weary of the process.

And I'm thinking, screw this. I've tried it your way. I've and I'm getting knocked to the mat every time I step in the ring.

and and and I I started kind of letting a little dishonesty creep in, you know, started thinking, you know, half measures avail my eye, you know, I I'm I'm going to get mine and I'm going, you know, so it's nothing serious. It was just like little wire fraud, a little uh a little income tax evasion, a little insurance, you know, and just the the stuff that everybody does. And and uh you know, I loved it.

My wife was sponsoring this lady that had a head-on collision. She was taking pills and she called her up and she was just as loaded as she can be. My wife let me hear the message and the lady like, "Katie, this is and and uh Katie called that girl sponsor and I'll never forget the lady, this is story has nothing to do with anything by the way." And uh and she was telling her about she goes, "She was loaded." And the woman goes, "Well, now we've all had our problems with pills." And you're like, "No, we haven't." And you know, but not for nothing.

That has nothing to do with anything. But uh um I thought I thought of it when I said things everybody does. But what what happened was I met this woman that lived in New York City and I got into a relationship that let's just say um it was a little dishonest, you know, and the most dishonest thing about it was me, you know.

I mean, she was she made she made a lot of money. I mean, Katie was my best friend for 20 years. Katie I was at her wedding.

We were like brother and sister um for over 20 years until her husband passed away. And uh we've been a couple for 10 years. But during all this time, I mean, we were really like brother and sister.

No flirtation, no innuendo, none of that stuff. Just buddies. And uh oh my gosh, she hated every relationship I was ever in.

I mean, but she really didn't like this one. And and you know, and at one point I remember her saying, "Charlie, if if this woman lives in Austin, I don't think you're dating her. And if she lived in Austin and made 30,000 a year, I guarantee you you're not dating her." And I remember thinking, well, she doesn't live in Austin and she makes just one hell of a lot more than 30,000 a year, so what's your point?

You know, and and and and I'm in this dishonest relationship, but I mean, I'm kind of like I'm rocking along and I'm do I'm very much about staying sober and I mean, the idea of getting loaded horrifies me. I've I've had surgeries without anything. I had a liver biopsy with nothing but local.

It freaked the doctor out. He was like when he ran that thing in me, he go it's like a meat thermometer and he ran it into the thing. He goes, "You mind if I ask what that felt like?" And I was like, "It was a lot like being stabbed, you know." uh you know but um but but um but I was very much about being sober and and I'm going to the meetings and I you know but I'm I mean let's just say there weren't a whole ton of people running up to me after the meeting saying you know could I get your phone number or uh would you take me through the work and uh but I'm rocking along and every you know and I would go up there and I'd think you know what this is I'm I'm going to get out of this marriage I think I'm going to tell her this weekend when I get up there and but then you get up there and it's Thursday, you know, and there's no just, you know, blowing it on Thursday.

I mean, and then and then, you know, I'll wait till and then next thing you know, you go, ah, it's Saturday, I'm going home tomorrow, you know, and we worried and and this does it sound a little dishonest, you know? I mean, this went on for uh a total of 12 years and uh and 8 years into the marriage, four years dating and 8 years into the marriage and uh um there were a lot there's a lot of stuff going on. Well, uh, we had a beach house out in the Hamptons that I had a key role in building and and, uh, one time we're out there for the weekend and and I had company out from South Carolina and we I decided we'd show these people Long Island from the air and we're going to charter our plane and we're going to fly from East Hampton Airport into LaGuardia and have a car pick us up and go to dinner.

And uh we're flying along. We take off and we're flying along in Long Long Island Forks out by the Hamptons. The South Fork is a Hampton's, North Fork, and in the middle is this piconic bay.

And we're flying over that. We're just passing shelter island. And I'm in the co-pilot seat.

It's a little six-seater Cessna 210 with retractable landing gear. And uh we're flying along and Yeah. And and I'm in the co-pilot seat and I put on the little headphones and let me tell you what you don't want to hear your charter pilot saying when you put the headphones on is come on, come on, come on, come on, come on.

You know, and uh and I'm going and I'm I'm looking at him and I'm and and and they said uh they said, "You're cleared to Gabretzky." and and I look and there's a runway at 10:00 and we're not going to make it. We're not going to make land. We're not going to clear the trees.

We're damn sure not going to make that runway. And he says, "You don't understand. I've lost engine power.

I can't make land. I'm going to have to ditch." And I remember thinking, "What?" I mean, I'm a gambler my whole life. I knew people that flew to the Hamptons every weekend for 20 years.

And first time I charter a plane, we're going to set it down at night in the drink. And what are the odds of that? You know, and and and uh he says uh he says, "Brace for impact." I'll never forget that.

He says, he turns kind of towards shore and he says, "Brace for impact." Anybody know how to do that? you know, and and and and we come in and b we hit the water and I mean it's just like Six Flags splash down times a thousand. There's water and spray and white and glass and noise and then absolute silence and all su I'm going, "Holy mack, I think we're okay." And I felt something on my knee.

Now, this wasn't much of an airplane. really crappy boat. You know, about the time I I I'm thinking, my god, I think we survived that landing.

All of a sudden, I feel something. It goes and I can't get the door open. And and uh and I I realize I got to get some air.

And I go up to get some air and there's nothing but water in the roof of that plane. And I remember thinking, "So that's it. That's it.

I die today in this blankety blank airplane." And uh and I went back down and the door came open. And I'd like to tell you that my first thought was pulling my wife out or my dog or the two people in the back or when I felt my feet come free. My first thought was I'm out.

I'm out. And I went up and I got some air and I came back down. I pulled my wife out.

I went back down and I got the dog out. And and uh the other people went out the other side. And we were on CNN with Anderson Cooper, live from the headlines with Anderson Cooper and all this stuff.

And and the reason I tell this story is because we survived. Uh Skip, spoiler alert, I survived. I uh but not by much.

You know, I came I came damn close to drowning. And uh um the reason I say that is because an event like that will make start looking at things differently. You know, I uh I started looking at at what was going on in my life, you know, because um I like to say that I was part of God's catch and release program, you know.

I mean, I was I was at Christian but AA conference a couple years ago and I caught this big trout, giant trout and uh and then we look at it. We take a couple pictures and we put it back in the water and I always picture that trout going back down to his little trout buddies going saw the sun. You know, I was in the boat.

You know, I just I can't help but think God's got a bigger plan for me. you know, I I I think I'm supposed to help other fishes, you know, but but what happened is as I come back to Austin, you know, and I started and and I started noticing some holes in my program. I'd started noticing how uh it took a keen eye.

But uh you know, and I used to feel guilty about telling that story because it feels like I ought to get up here and tell you how I've been a shining example of AA principles since the day that I came in. And I used to feel bad about not being that guy till I found out I had so much company, you know? I mean, there's there's a lot of us that aren't quite nailing it, you know?

And uh and what happened was uh but I called up John Henry, this old-timer in Austin, and I said, "John Henry, man," I said, "Uh, I'm so self-centered. I can't even be in a conversation with anybody. I mean, I have to just force myself to go, "Hey, Zach, how are the kids?" And act like I give a flip about the answer because I don't.

All I care about is me and me and me and and it was all over me. I didn't realize it was mentioned in our book. But I mean, the level of self-centerness that I carried around as a as a 15-year sober member of Alcoholics Anonymous was it was unbelievable.

I mean, I remember one time walking into the big AA club there in Austin. He had this uh card room and uh we call it the half measures room. And uh and and the guys that play Ramy in there, you know, and I I walk in there one day and this guy that I've known for a long time, he goes, "Hey, Charlie, what's up?" And I go, "Hey, uh" he goes, "Uh, we need to go back out to Vegas sometime." And I go, "Yeah, yeah, we do." And I turn around and I am horrified because I got zero memory of ever being in Vegas with this guy.

And I'm 15 years sober, you know, and I start thinking about it and I'm thinking about it and I remember there was a trip to Vegas where four guys went out there, a bunch of a guys, and we played golf and gambled and got massages and knocked around, you know, and all that. But the reason I didn't remember being in Vegas with this guy is because I wasn't in Vegas with this guy. I was in Vegas with me.

And this guy just happened to be along for the ride. I hope I'm sure I'm the only one that's that self-centered. Uh it probably doesn't happen in California, but it's it's rampant in Texas, you know, and and and you know, and I mean, and that's the level of self-centerness I carry.

I guarantee you that's what we're going to talk about tomorrow because uh cuz that's I mean, that's all I'm about, you I mean, my poor sponsor is now must just be going, "Oh, no. I got a sponsor that's only read three pages out of the big book, you know, cuz all we and we're going to I don't even tell you which three they are. We'll talk about it tomorrow." But, you know what happened was I started getting into this work and John Henry, I'll never forget it.

He goes, "Meet me tomorrow. We'll go down to the ranch at the treatment center." He goes, "I'm going to go talk to the winos." You know, and service work doesn't sound like a good idea, you know. I mean, when you especially when I'm that selfobsessed, I'm like, "No." Um, I was kind of hoping we'd meet somewhere and talk about the depth of my problems, you know, and uh and I started working with these guys and and and uh they were and I'm the 17 I'm the 15 16 year guy, you know, so they're asking me to sponsor them and and there were times where now I could talk to you about life coach stuff and and uh cuz I'd made so many brilliant choices in my life, but uh but as far as taking a newcomer through the steps, you know, it had been a while And and there were times when I'd just be like, "Go read the doctor's opinion and Bill's story." And I'd go read the doctor's opinion and Bill's story.

There were times where I felt like I was a step ahead of this guy. But I fell in with a crew of guys. One of my buddies had gone to treatment down at Laosianda and hooked up with a bunch of big book people down there.

And we and our conversation started being about, you know, what do you do when they say this? What do you about when they say that? And and about that time, so I'm starting to take an interest in the big book and how to have answers that are coming out of the book.

And I start and and I started really getting excited about those conversations and uh I'm seeing stuff that I'd never seen before. I'm seeing stuff in the book where I'm going that's surely that's only in the fourth edition, right? I mean I', you know, I've never never seen and that still happens to me.

But I started doing this work and about that time. Uh, a guy called me and he goes, "Hey, I heard something about a big book study up in Dallas." Now, we're in Austin. And I go, you know, uh, I'll check.

And I called a couple of my guys up in Dallas and they sent me this flyer and it said, uh, Mark H and this other guy doing a big book weekend, you know. And I'm like, I told Katie, I said, you know, I don't think this is what Dick was looking for, but this this guy is Chris's sponsor, and I like Chris. I've been listening to Chris a little bit.

And uh and so we wind up going and my wife is like, "What?" You know, I mean, we wouldn't have been that excited about a big book meeting, much less a weekend, you know, oh boy, let's talk about the big book, you know, and and and uh cuz she was 17 years sober at the time. And and we go up there and I meet this guy named Mark Houston. And I can almost never say his name without weeping because of uh the power of God spoke to me through this guy Mark Houston and uh oh my god I mean we're sitting in this study and I mean there were times he's coming out of he's telling he's saying stuff and I remember at one point leaning over to my wife and going what book is this guy reading from?

I mean, I have never heard any of the stuff he's talking about? And I mean, I just he just blew me away. And he wound up moving to Austin and uh he became my sponsor and sponsored me from then until he died suddenly um three years ago.

And um but I tell you, in the time we worked together, my whole life changed. And I started I found out there was a a a group of people working this program at a level that I'd never that I'd never experienced. I mean, you know, they were they they were really into doing the work, you know, at a high level and and meeting regularly and talking about, you know, this program and and, you know, having spiritual consent with each other and having brothers that you that loved me enough to call me on stuff whether it was going to hurt my feelings or not.

And that was an established relationship where we said, "I'm giving you permission to call me on anything you see me doing, whether it hurts my feelings or not." You know, and because otherwise we get into what we call these unsigned death packs with each other where it's like, "Look, you don't call me on my deal, I won't call you on your stuff. Nod your head if you understand, you know, and and we and we'd move forward like that." Well, this was a now and it was all done under the path of consideration and and with love and and concern for each other. We weren't just breaking each other's chops all the time.

But I mean, you would it would say stuff like, you know, is it possible that or I'd like to offer for your consideration that maybe, you know, because otherwise you're going to hear my ego defending itself and telling you why you got the story wrong. And if you let me tell the story, I'll never forget the first time. I'm all over the place, but we're going I'll be done here in a minute.

Um, at that workshop at one point, Mark brings this guy up and I think his name was Paul. And he bring Paul come up here. He's this little guy Mark had been kind of picking on the whole weekend and and uh in a kind of way.

And he he gets him up there and he goes, "Paul, let me ask you something." He goes, "This is just an example of the kind of work Mark did. He was he was had a lot of clarity and he was very direct." And he gets this guy, he goes, "Paul, do you meditate?" And Paul goes, "Well, um I'm a truck driver. See, and uh a lot of times when I'm driving the truck, I'll meditate, you know, and uh and uh Mark goes, I'll never forget it." Mark goes, "Okay, Paul, two things." Um he goes, "First of all, when you're driving the truck, we very much want you to be about driving the truck.

You know, I mean, we really don't need you hurdling down the road in a tractor trailer rig meditating." And he goes, he goes, "Second of all, in the future, when I ask you a yes or no question, man, I love that guy." He says, "In the future, when I ask you a yes or no question, I'm going to expect a yes or no response. So, I'm going to ask you again if you meditate." And it's very important to me for you to say no. And I remember sitting there going, "Whoa, man.

Am I glad he didn't call me up there, you know, but Mark used to say, you can ask an alcoholic if they're married and you get a 5minute answer, you know. I mean, it's like that was a yes or no question, you know." But, uh, we started doing this work at a whole another level. And I mean and we started having I started having a meeting at my house on Thursday nights and it was Mark and me and all my sponsors and we're it's the it's the best day I've ever been involved in.

We're meeting every week and we're talking about the amends process and writing amends cards and going out and making all of our amends and some of mine were 25 years old or 20 years old, you know, and and and and that's the stuff I want to talk about this weekend. But it just turned out that there was there was a level of the game going on I didn't even know about. I mean, I I'm an NFL football fan.

I I assume we're all Dallas Cowboy fans here. Uh I uh I've been a I love saying that. I said that in Philadelphia the other day and I was like, "So, so much for the city of brother we love." But I I've been a Cowboy fan since they were good, you know, and and and uh and and I'm sponsoring this guy one time and and he says uh he says, you know, my family's got a skybox at at Texas Stadium.

And I'm like, "Yeah, good for you." You know, and uh I mean, few months later, he calls me up one day and he goes, "Hey, man. You want to go to the see the uh Eagles game Monday night and sit in our skybox?" And I said, "Yes, I do." And and I go to his grandfather's house and we get in the car and we go down to Texas Stadium. Now, I've had season tickets before and you know, we go to a special little parking lot.

We go in through a special little gate. We go up a quiet little escalator into this little quiet hallway and we go down to this skybox and the the field is right there and there's little waiters bringing in cookies and ice. And I'm looking around.

I don't know whether to be excited about being in this skybox or to be pissed off about having sat in the cheap seats for 20 years, but that was exactly my experience with Alcoholics Anonymous. If I almost missed it. If I had died in that car wreck, in that plane crash, if I had died, if if you'd have come to me when I had 17 years of sobriety and said, Charlie, what is going to change your life and set you on fire is the program of Alcoholics Anonymous coming right out of the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous.

I would have told you you're crazy, man. Cuz I've been in AA for 17 years. I know what AA has to offer me.

And I had never stuck a toe in the water. Just like those football games, it turned out there was people doing this deal at a level that I had never experienced before. I have just been on fire with AA for the last 10 years and a little over.

And uh I'm I live in an AA household. My wife is a very active AA member. She sponsors a ton of people.

She's the best at hearing inventory of anybody I've ever seen. And and we're going to talk about that some when we talk about the inventory process because there was a time when that wouldn't have made any sense to me, you know, how could one person be better than at hearing inventory than it's like saying that somebody's really good at listening to a CD or something, you know, but now it it makes a lot of sense to me and and that's the kind of stuff we talk about. I am so grateful to have gotten well first of all that I didn't die in that plane crash 10 years ago but the level of life that I've been experiencing since then is so far and away beyond anything that I'd ever experienced.

I mean, I can't even tell you about it. When that's I mean, I get emotional when I see the clear and obvious hand of God moving in my life. And looking back on one time, uh, Mark, we were talking to Mark one day and he goes, "Do you really think you had anything to do with being at that big book workshop that weekend?" I mean, looking back on it, I can see where God just moved us into a direction of being right where he wanted us to be, where we could be of maximum service.

There's a quote on page 100 that I like to close with. It says, "Both you and the new man must walk day by day in the path of spiritual progress. If you persist, remarkable things will happen.

When we look back, we realize the things which came to us when we put ourselves in God's hands were better than anything we could have planned. I had been reading this and closing talks with it for a long time before I ever saw that line that says when we look back cuz you know God's will, I'm the only one that God's will looks like it's going to be kind of a ripoff, you know. I mean, it looks like a jip on the front end, you know?

I mean, really mail that much money to the IRS, you know, or something. But it says when we look back, we see that the things that came to us when we put ourselves in God's hands were better than anything we could have planned. Cuz I can't see it on the front end.

Excuse me. Follow the dictates of a higher power and you will presently live in a new and wonderful world. no matter what your present circumstances.

I'm really looking forward to this weekend. I love AA. I love drunks and I love talking about this stuff.

I thank God for bringing me back to AA and I thank AA for bringing me back to my relationship with God. Thanks for listening to me. God was that Joe had been Joe was quite a seeker and he'd been all over.

had been at the ashrams and sat at the feet of the Daly Lama and studied Eastern religion, Western religion, you name it. And and he then he came to Don and he said, "Uh, will you sponsor me?" And Don said, "Well, look, I'll sponsor you, but if if I'm going to sponsor you, we're going to be coming out of the big book." So, you're going to have to put all that other crap aside and and we're going to come out of the big book. And out of that, he always gave Don credit for writing the set aside prayer, but Don said, "I didn't write it." Joe wrote it based on that conversation.

But it is a prayer that basically goes something like, "God, please help me to set aside everything I think I know about myself, alcoholism, AA, the big book, and even you, God. Help me to have an open mind so that I can have a new experience, words to that effect." And I work with that a lot with my guys and with myself. I try to read two pages a day out of the big book.

And I can't tell you how many times I've gotten up in the morning, done the set aside prayer. It it's this probably doesn't happen to you guys, but I tend to read the book and I'm not necessarily looking for new information, especially if I've been reading a long time. I'm looking for ways that I'm already right.

I got a bad habit of, you know, you know, reading and and so I don't know I'm missing stuff. You know, when we say, "How do you know what you don't know?" I mean, that'll give you a brain cramp if you if you think about it. But If I'm not careful, what I think I know can stand in the way of the truth.

And it happens way into sobriety, you know, because what happens is I'm reading the book and I'm reading along and I go, "Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. This is that part where it says that.

Oh, yeah. Yeah, I know this. Yeah.

Oh, there's that Jaywalker, whatever." But, uh, but, you know, but I get to pieces and I go, "Oh, you can't tell me anything about this piece." You know, I've already got it highlighted and underlined, you know, in in the book. And it's amazing how many times I'll do the set aside prayer and and a brand new piece of information will come up off off the page. And so I really I like working with it because I don't know.

I mean otherwise I'm just looking for we call it a confirmation bias where I'm just really kind of looking for confirmation of ways that I'm already right and I'm not I'm not picking up a whole lot of new information that way. and and uh um a lot of things happen when you start coming at somebody with something that differs from what their current belief system is or god forbid you come at me with something that differs from what my beloved sponsor told me. Um the ego goes into self-defense mode and and now it's literally about the life and death of the ego.

It's not about the little issue anymore. It's the ego fighting for its life. So that's why we use the path of consideration and spiritual consent and you know phrases like is it possible that or I'd like to offer your for your consideration that maybe because if if you if it's just ways to try to get information around the ego without it going into uh self-defense cuz I mean not right now uh um I talked about being a recovered alcoholic, you know, and and I didn't hear that for a long time.

And I don't usually say that in a regular talk because one of the things I worry about is alienating the exact guys. And you know, it's one thing to preach to the choir, but I don't want to shut down the guy, the exact guys I'm talking to, cuz I've been that guy. You know, I was the guy that's like, "Oh, he's one of those, you know, and and you know, and I'm done, you know.

I'm I'm not trying to hear anything else." And and uh but if we're going to talk about recovering recovery, I don't know. It's funny. I was talking to Bill one day and I was saying the funny thing in AA is that when we form a firing squad, we always form a circle, you know.

you know, and you know, and so we wind up with some of our best members that are out there in the trenches slugging away all about saving drunks, but we're fighting over recovered recovering or spons. But if we're if we're going to talk about being recovered, what because you could argue it both ways, but if we're going to talk about h what are we talking about having recovered from? And in the forward, you know, there on that title page, it said that in the forward of the first edition, it says, "We of Alcoholics Anonymous are more than 100 men and women who have recovered from a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body.

To show other alcoholics precisely how we have recovered is the main purpose of this book. You know, they thought they had discovered something big enough that that it was worth putting in book form, you know, so it didn't get all scattered out like that telephone game where you start a little saying off here and by the time it gets to the back of the room, it's not anything like what we're talking about. You know, I I do love that line where it says to show others precisely how we have recovered is the main purpose of this book.

They felt they found something. You know, what what really made AA a big deal when it hit the ground was an understanding of three things. It was an understanding of the problem with alcoholism, an a solution for that problem, and then a program of action that would bring about that solution.

And the book is full of stories where people had two out of three of those things, but it was those three things coming together. And I I always compare it to like if we were to go out to the car after the meeting and uh let's say I don't know anything about cars and I go out there and I stick my key in the car and it nothing happens. Well, I don't now I'm stuck, right?

I don't even know what the problem is, you know? And then so I'm sitting there and I'm not going and then let's say Bruce comes up and goes, "Oh man, you left your headlights on. you know, your headlights have been on all night.

You've run the battery down. That's that's what your problem is. You got a dead battery.

I'm like, okay, now I understand the problem. The problem is I got a dead battery. Am I going anywhere?

No. You know, because now I don't know what to do about it, you know. And he goes, "Well, you got to get some juice in that battery, you know, cuz it turns the starter and the starter fires, you know." I go, "Okay, now I know the solution.

I got to get some juice in that battery. Still stuck. You know, Bill's like, Bill comes up and goes, "Raise your hood.

I got jumper cables in my car. I'm going to pull over here next to it. We're going to put black on black.

We're going to put red on red. I'm going to rev the engine. When I give you the signal, turn the key." Now, I got a program of action that'll bring about the solution to my problem.

But if we're not careful, I think we can diminish the problem. and and the book, you know, I think sometimes we have a tendency, we talk about qualifying the new guy, and I I do like when I I mean, I don't think I need to stand guard at the door of the AA, you know, and make sure that we're not being in infiltrated by filthy dope fans or or, you know, I mean, stuff like But I mean, I I do think it's important to find out if this guy's one of us and if he's in the right room. And if he's not in the right room, try to find the fellowship that he's going to identify in as much as I identify in the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous because and you always hear people saying, "Well, it's really just one solution and that sort of thing." But if you carry it through to the 12th step, when that guy's been around a minute and somebody comes up to him and says, "Will you sponsor me?" They're not going to have that identification that takes.

And I really believe what the book says about how important that because if when that identification takes place, I'm willing to take action that I don't even have to understand you. And we'll get we'll get back to that maybe. But so if we're talking about having recovered, what are we talking about having recovered from?

It says we have recovered from a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body. And um you hear when I was talking about disregarding the problem, you know, I think sometimes we assume that when a guy gets in, my first job when I sit down with a new guy is to give him what I call a fatal dose of alcoholism. Um there's so you know I I think we tend to think you know nobody gets to AA by mistake or I've heard treatment there was a treatment center at home that would say uh you work the first step getting here.

Anybody heard that one? Yeah. Well, it wasn't my experience and it wasn't Dr.

Bob's experience and it wasn't Fred's experience and it wasn't there was there's a lot of examples in the book of you know and like with Dr. Bob it said he'd been banging around Oxford for a couple of years. He and he and it says that he suspected a spiritual remedy might help him with his problem.

So he knew the solution and he had a program of action but it he didn't understand the problem. It wasn't until it says when the broker explained alcoholism to him the way Silkworth had explained it to him he he went after the spiritual remedy with a energy I'm paraphrasing now energy he had never been able to put forward before and he sobered never to drink again for the rest of his life. That's how important the explanation of the problem was to Bob.

And we'll talk more about where they understood the problem and the solution but didn't have a program of action. But you know, I think it when it talks about being one of our members properly armed with the facts about himself and you know, some of this stuff we're going to talk about is stuff that really helps me in my own experience. Sometimes it helps in in taking new guys through the work cuz I like I said there was a time when I was a little I felt a little awkward about taking a brand new guy through the work after I'd been around for a while.

I mean there was a time when I call it slogan slinging you know where if you'd come at me I'd have been like okay um put the plug in the jug. That's a good one. You know and uh and and uh and do 90 meetings in 90 days.

Don't drink no matter what. uh you know and uh and take this book uh take this book and read uh well just read the whole damn thing and you know and and and you know and there was sometimes there was parts of me that kind of hoped the guy didn't really call back you know cuz I really I really kind I hoped he found some solution but in my heart I knew I didn't have it for him you know and uh I hope all the stuff we're going to talk about today is redundant uh for everybody but um my experience was that I didn't when it talks about being an ex-prom drinker who has found our solution who's properly armed with the facts about himself. What does it mean to be armed with the facts about myself?

And I like to talk about what it means to be an alcoholic because just a whole I spent a good deal of time sitting in AA meetings raising my hand saying I'm Charlie Parker. I'm alcoholic and I didn't know what it meant. So, if we're talking about having recovered, what are we talking about having recovered from?

And I always say that I only have two problems as an alcoholic. I only have two struggles with alcohol. One happens to me when I drink it, and the other one happens to me when I don't drink it.

Other than that, I really don't have any struggles with alcohol. Just just gives me trouble when I'm drinking it or when I'm not drinking it, you know. But but the the first piece of it is this physical piece of alcoholism and and and the doctor's opinion talks a lot about that I have an abnormal reaction to drinking.

You know, it says that I it's on Roman numeral 28. It's funny. I was talking about primary purpose group and and and we study the book.

Now, we're not just studying the book to have a ready answer in a discussion meeting or something. We're trying to get clarity on the message that they laid out in the book. What are they talking about and in what order?

You know, why are they laying this? Why are we talking about Fred and why are we talking about him now? You know, if they were able to put this whole solution in a in a such a small I mean, we could sit down and write, you know, 200 pages on step one, you know, and they put the whole deal, you know, in the first 164 pages of the book and the bulk of it really in the first 103 pages.

if they were able to be that concise with it. What information did they find important to put forward and in what order, you know, and and and that's what we're we're studying. We don't like read a page and talk about our experience with it.

We talk about what were the founders trying to what information were they trying to put forth in that page. And uh we were talking about the doctor's opinion because we're back at the front of the book. It's funny.

I mean, somebody said one time, they go, "What are you going to do about your meeting?" I mean, it's standing room only. You know, there were people around the walls and I was like, "Oh, don't worry. When we get into to wives and to employer and then when we get back to the front, you know, the room starts filling up again." But we're back in the doctor's opinion.

One of the things I never really thought about is I I use the doctor's opinion a lot. I was talking to somebody else that was talking about, you know, really pounding the doctor's opinion this morning. I had always given Dr.

Silkworth credit for endorsing our book, you know, I mean, they had written, these drunks had written this book and we need some street cred or we need some really legitimate cred, you know, so they go to this doctor. And I'd always given them credit, but really I never really thought about how much I use the doctor's opinion when I'm working with a new guy. And I and and it kind of came to me the other day that, you know, they'd already written a book when they handed it to Silkworth and he didn't just endorse our book, he added a great deal to it.

I mean, there's a lot of really powerful information in the doctor's opinion. And one of the pages I work with a ton is Roman numeral 28. XXB I I I uh I use this page in every conversation with a new guy or sometimes it's with I was in Bermuda last week and I met a guy that was at this Thanksgiving dinner and I said, "How long you sober?" And he goes, "13 months." And I said, "Where you at in the step work?" We're just talking, you know.

And he goes, "Well, I'm still kind of on step four." And in my mind, I'm thinking, "Probably not." You know, and cuz I'm I'm about getting through this work pretty rapidly. And and you know, and I spent four hours with the guy the next morning down by the water. And we and now he's on step four.

But but but and you know and and my favorite thing to hear and when you're working with a guy like that is to have a guy that's been around a while because he had six years another time and he goes I've never heard the stuff you're talking about. That's to me that's the best thing there is to hear is to have a guy that you know go I've been in and out of the area for x number of times and I've never heard any of this stuff you know and um well so a lot of times I'll have them I'll recap even if it's a guy that's been around for a while we'll recap these first steps you know and sometimes I'll say teach it to me you know if why don't you tell me what step one means what does it mean to be an alcoholic you know cuz one guy was ready to do his his third step and about inventory. And I said, "Uh, tell me about step one.

What does it mean?" He goes, "That I'm alcoholic and I can't manage my own life." And he was proud of himself, you know. And I said, "What does that mean to you?" He's like, "Oh, um, it means I can't go through one day without drinking." I said, "Okay, so so if I can go through a day without drinking, I'm not alcoholic." Oh, darn it. you know, you know, so we we had to have a conversation about what it means to be an alcoholic in Silkworth.

It was a big deal because, you know, it doesn't take too many times to telling my dad, "I'll never do this again and showing back up and do it again." You know, for me to think that there's something wrong with me. You know, when I showed up here, I'm I'm thinking disease my ass. There is something bad wrong with me.

You know, because I keep saying I'm not going to do it anymore and I and I do. Well, so for a long time they thought it was a moral issue or issue of control and that sort of thing. So, but when we talk about what it means to be an alcoholic, the big one of the big things that Silkworth brought to the table was right here on Roman numeral 28.

He says, "We believe and so suggested a few years ago, he had written a paper about four years earlier putting these points forward." He says that the action of alcohol on these chronic alcoholics is a manifestation of an allergy. I like to break these pages down when I'm talking to to guys and stuff and it says that the phenomenon of craving is limited to this class and never occurs in the average temperate drinker. I am so capable of reading a line like that and just have it go, you know, and breaking it down.

It says that we believe that the action of alcohol on who? On these chronic alcoholics, right? We're not talking about candy ass little disco drunks here, you know.

I mean, you know, what we call two beers and oh dear, you know, I mean, you know, it's you know, yeah, we're talking about chronic alcoholics, guys that have been running it for a while. And and it says that the axon of these guys is the manifestation of an allergy. Well, you know, allergy was a new term in the early 1900s.

and and but but for our purposes, we're just going to say it means an abnormal physical reaction. Something happens to me when I drink that ain't regular. It doesn't happen to my sister.

My sister's non-alcoholic and uh I mean, when she drinks, um it doesn't trigger this this this allergy with her. So, if an and if like we said, all we're going to say an allergy means is an abnormal physical reaction, right? Let's say I had an abnormal and and and it says the manifestational analogy.

All manifestation means is the way something shows up, the way something presents itself. Let's say this whole front row here was just over at breakfast and they had a big basket of strawberries and we all sat there and ate strawberries except we come over here and I start going, you know, and all of a sudden my throat starts kind of swelling shut and my eyes are swelling shut, you know, and everybody else is fine but I got an abnormal physical reaction to strawberries and the way it manifests is in that swelling shut and you you know, well, how does my allergy to alcohol manifest? How what happens when I drink alcohol?

And it calls it this phenomenon of craving? Well, phenomenon just means something that we know happens, but we don't really know why it happens. We've seen it happen enough to know that it happens, but we don't really know why it happens.

And and what what is this? What happens when I drink? It calls it craving.

It says like when I drink for me it triggers a craving that is beyond my control. Right? When I start drinking it triggers a craving for more booze that so when I take the first drink it triggers a craving for the second drink.

This is the physical piece of alcoholism. And by the time I get to the fifth drink it sounds like a better idea than the second one did. You know and I don't really need to read this book or it doesn't matter what Charlie says.

The most important thing you can do with any of the stuff in this book, I mean that a new guy can do with any of this stuff is lay it up against your own experience and see if it's a fit. See what happens when I drink. Does it?

Because but the thing is the disease is tricky. You know, my my mind never tells me, you know, I don't ever remember walking into a Spillway pub there in East Dallas and going, "Oh, Bobby, Bobby, Bobby, Bobby, God almighty, spiritual malady is on me today." you know, and I had a beer on the way over here and it has triggered a phenomenon of craving that is kicking my ass, you know. I mean, you know, I and and you know, I just and the thing about it is I never thought I'd triggered the phenomenon of craving.

I just thought I changed my mind, right? You know, you you know you know where you go I'm just the guys at work go, "Hey, we're going to go have a couple of drinks after work at the pool hall." You know, and I'm like, "Would you like to go?" I'm like, "Yes, I would." And then I get over there and and they go, "Hey, listen, dude. Uh, I got to bounce.

Uh, the old lady's making spaghetti at the house, and I'm I'm the guy that's going to spaghetti. Really?" Um, no. Rock on, dude.

Uh, I'm going I changed my mind. I'm I'm going to stay here, you know. And I never thought I'd triggered this craving, but I if I told you that I was going in to have a couple of drinks and I get in there and turns out two was a bad number, you know, I should have guessed higher, you know, and and and next thing you know, I'm off on a run.

And the book in the doctor's opinion in the first 23 pages of the book does an awful lot talking about this physical allergy to alcohol. And I've even got one of my one of my sponsies made a a little uh graphic about it that is part of that stuff that I sent out. He even put the two little fists in there.

It's I that's where I see guys on the street in Austin that I've met at the tra like Charlie what's up? You know I mean but when when we talk about what happens when I drink is the first piece and it's it's it says that it never occurs in the average temperate drinker. It goes on to say, "These allergic types can never safely use alcohol in any form at all." And I have to ask myself, we one of the things in my crew is we're big on turning statements into questions out of the big book.

Taking statements that are in the big book and turning them into questions and asking myself, is this my condition? Is this true for me? Do I find myself with these beliefs based on my experience?

Is this true for me? And I have to ask myself, are these true? That once having formed the habit and I'm found I cannot break it.

Once having lost my self-confidence, their reliance upon things human, my problems pile up on me and become astonishingly difficult to solve. Damn, nobody shows up for AA on a winning streak. You know, I mean, that thing about problems piling up and becoming astonishingly difficult to solve.

God almighty. But this thing about well says frothy emotional appeal seldom suffices. The message which can interest and hold these alcoholic people must have depth and weight.

You know, you can't just come at me with, you know, some that identification that takes place when one drunk is talking to another. One of the best ways to illustrate how important it is is when it's not there. I was I showed up for treatment on December 8th of 83.

And I'm a big boy now, but I was about 25 pounds heavier then. And uh I say that because I was really interested in Christmas dinner. You know, we it was Christmas Day and they had put the whole deal out.

It was, you know, turkey and dressing and and mashed potatoes and cranberry sauce and giblet gravy and rolls and and uh and I'm just sitting down with my big old Jethro plate and uh and right as I'm sitting down, the door swings open and in walks five people from one of the local churches. There's some dogooders from one of the local churches and they've come to sing Christmas carols to us healing alcoholics, right? You can imagine my excitement, right?

You know, cuz now I don't get to eat. And uh and and they're going to sing. And this one woman, I watch her and she's walking along and she leans over and she says something to this guy and then she says something to this guy and she says something to this lady and when she gets to me she says, "Uh, are you a patient here?" And I said, "Yes, I am." She said, 'I know exactly what you're going through.

I said, 'Really?' And she said, 'Yes, I was once addicted to caffeine. And I was like, ain't that a You know, I'm like I'm like, let me ask you a question. Uh, did you ever pawn your mom's sterling silver to get a can of folders?

You know, I mean, bless your heart, that's what people do. They they they're trying to identify, but it it ain't there, you know. Uh well, that's that depth and weight we're talking about.

And it says in nearly all cases, in nearly all cases, their ideals must be grounded in a power greater than themselves. Well, I got to I want to get rolling so we can get through step one. But down here at the bottom of that page, it says men and women drink essentially because they like the effect produced by alcohol.

>> Any argument on that one? You know, I mean, I like banana pudding, but I love the effect produced by alcohol. I I didn't just burn my world to the ground over something, I kind of dig a little bit, you know?

I mean, it was But it says the sensation is so elusive that while I admit it's harmful, while I admit it's injurious, after a while, I can't differentiate the truth from the false. And the one of the ways I can't differentiate the truth from the false is and I love the way Clancy says if if he gave every one of us a flag to wave when we get here everybody's flag would say the same thing. It would say you don't understand my case is different.

You don't understand. My case is different because my, you know, the feeling I show up here with is if look, I understand you got your little 12step thing here, but if you understood how complicated and complex a person I am and my background and and you know, you you'd you'd really be a little embarrassed to be offering me your little hanky 12step thing, you know, and and so it goes on to say, "And one of the ways I can't tell the truth from the false is I think come fixing to get a handle on it. I'm the guy sitting in a treatment center thinking I ain't like these other guys.

You know, if I ever get as lame as these guys, maybe I'll do your little deal, but I just need to rest up a minute. I know I was in a bad spot. I know it looks bad that I'm sitting in this county funded detox center, but but you know, I was just but but when I get out of here, I'm going to manage this thing a little better and I ain't like these guys and I don't have to do what they do because I ain't like that.

you know, when I get out of here, I'm going to manage this thing a little better. I'm not going to drink tequila anymore. I'm not going to drink with those guys.

I'm going to I'm going to, you know, I'm probably going to start studying the Bible or something, you know. I mean, but, you know, I mean, you know, but I ain't like this and I don't have to do that. And that happens in pretty short order.

Dr. Harry Tibo wrote some papers about us where he said, "The recuperative powers of the alcoholic ego are astounding." you know, and this was a non-alcoholic watching us because, you know, on day one, I'm like, "Oh, please help me. I, you know, I'll do anything." You know, and after a couple of weeks, I start going, "I don't really like this place, you know.

I I don't like my counselor. I don't like the program here. Have you seen that Nimrod they gave me for a roommate?" you know, I mean, and the food for God's sakes, you know, and you know, and this is 10 days after I'll do anything, you know, I mean, and it happens over and over and over again.

And it says, uh, um, to them, their alcoholic life seems the only normal one. I love that. I mean, because, you know, I always say if if I went to my sainted 90-year-old mother and said, "Mom, I can't come over today.

I got to go see my PO and give a UA cuz I got a DUI. She would have no idea what I'm talking about. You know, around here we're like, "Oh man, dude, who's your PO?" You know, how much time you got?

I can tell you how to beat a UA. You know, you know, and you know, I mean, and my alcoholic life seems the only woman because of the time, you know, my mother, I told you she was a 40 first grade school teacher. She had a way of moving just this one finger when she would talk to you, you know, and and I can remember her going and it would always start off with, "You are such an idiot.

You drink every day." And I'm but I'm as I'm sitting there, I'm untouched by that because I'm thinking everybody I know drinks every day. You know, I don't I don't hang with somebody that doesn't drink every day. And what I didn't know to tell her is that if drinking did for you what it does for me, you'd be stupid not to drink every day.

You know, why wouldn't I drink every day? It's the greatest thing I ever, you know. Well, it goes on to say, here's where it gets ugly.

It says, if you go to page 23, there's a little piece where it says, I've written in that little space under the first line, I've written looking at the body stops here. Because on the page before it says, we're equally positive that once he takes alcohol, whatever, into his system, something happens both in the bodily and mental sense, which makes it virtually impossible for him to stop. You know, and in do in the doctor's opinion, he describes five types of alcoholics.

And it doesn't matter. There's a squillion types of us, but it says all these and many other types have one thing in common. They can't start drinking without triggering this phenomenon of craving.

This thing that happens when I start drinking. It's a big problem. But over on page 23, it says these observations, what observations?

All these observations they've been making about what happens to me when I drink. It says these observations would be academic and pointless. I always say that means that translates to wouldn't mean squat.

>> No, I'm sorry. P number 23, page 23 when there is a solution. It's up to the doctor's opinion in the first 23 pages talks about this physical reaction to alcohol.

And right here on page 23, it shifts and it's not talking about the body anymore. And it says, "These observations," this top of page 23, "These observations would be academic and pointless if our friend never took the first drink, thereby setting the terrible cycle in motion." You know, it's a big problem what happens to me when I drink vodka. It triggers this craving.

It sends me on a run that I got really no control over. But if my biggest problem was what happens when I drink 4 ounces of vodka, what would my solution be? Don't drink vodka, you know, and be like the guy that, you know, says, "Doc, it hurts when I do this." And the doctor says, "Well, don't do that." You know, I mean, but just think of what a crappy Is it Mike?

Tom. >> Tom. Imagine what a crappy program this would be if we bring Tom in here, you know, and we go, "Okay, Tom.

Um, you got a physical reaction to alcohol that ain't regular. When you drink, it's going to trigger a run that, you know, in the long run, it's going to get away from you. And it's and it's and it's really it's really going to get ugly.

And over the long run, it's just going to get worse and worse. Quit it. Just quit it, you know.

Well, then but it goes into this thing is, and this is where the second piece of alcoholism comes in is what happens when I don't drink. Because I never thought about this for a long time. Every time I ever took that first drink, the drink that triggers another run or a spree as the big book calls it.

Every time I ever took that first drink, I was stone cold sober, right? I can't blame the first drink on being loaded. I make that decision stone cold sober.

The craziest guy. It's funny. I had my guys one time, we all sat down and wrote down, "What's the most insane thing you've ever done?

Give me a list of about four or five things. Makes for a hell of a discussion. But but none of us put down the single most insane thing any of us ever done.

And the most based on my experience and my background, the most insane thing that I can do is take another run at it, you know, is go, I think I'm going to try shooting dope one more time or I'm going to try drinking one more time. I think I can handle it this time, you know, and and because and I make that decision stone cold sober. That's where the second this is what happens to me when I'm not drinking.

And going back to that Roman numeral 28 in in the doctor's opinion, he talks about it. He says, "I'm restless, irritable, and discontented." Now, this is sober. This is when I'm not drinking.

I get a little get a little restless, you know. I get a little jumpy. I don't like the way my clothes are touching me.

Um, you know, if I if I'm it feels if I'm inside sitting down, it feels like I ought to be outside walking around and and I'm just I just I'm like a dog that can't find a spot. You know, I'm circling around, but I just don't feel I don't feel right. And I get a little restless and then irritable.

God almighty after a couple of weeks, couple of days, whatever it is, I start getting a little irritable, you know, and I mean, I never really liked the idea of being irrit. It's funny. I was talking to a sponsor the other day.

He goes, I came home from work today. He goes, I was kind of irritated. this uh supervisor at work and then I was irritated at Heather when I got and the guy in traffic irritated me and you know this is condensed in the conversation but I said you know it's funny I uh I hear you talking a lot about being irritated you know today and he goes yeah I go but you probably wouldn't like being described as irritable and he goes no I wouldn't you know I mean you know it's like I never thought I was irritable but it's not my fault if I just become keenly aware of how stupid everybody else is, you know.

I mean, that's just being observant, you know. You know, I mean, you know, and and before I know it, you know, the guy at work is a dumbass, and my boss is a dumbass, and this guy in front of me in traffic is a and the guy behind my ass is a is a maniac, and and uh and you know, I think that guy just gave me a look, you know, and and and before long, I'm just I'm just a little irritable, you And I always say that, you know, I'm in the grocery store. I'm following somebody three miles past the exit to my house so I can tell them they're number one.

And and uh and and and then, you know, I'm the policeman of the world, you know. It's it's it's my job to throw a flag on the field anytime I see a violation anywhere, you know, and and if if I see position of neutrality is not even part of my, you know, you know, the guy in front of me at the grocery store has got 14 items on the 10 item lane. And the reason I know is cuz I counted every, you know, and on the wrong day, I'm the guy that's going, "Okay, pal, which of those items you want to put back?" you know, and if he comes back with the wrong answer, it's a bad day at the grocery store, you know, and next thing you know, I'm calling the family from jail, you know, and and I'm and and I'm going, "How do I get arrested buying milk, you know?

I mean, I just I was trying to do the right thing. I just went to the grocery store to get milk for the kids and but you know somebody's got to say something you know to this guy you know somebody's got to draw a line in the sand and if not me who you know you know and and that's the way you know and then I get a little discontented you know discontented means I don't like the deal I'm getting. You can give one of us $150,000 a year job and inside of six months I'll tell you how I'm getting screwed around.

you know, I mean, you know, I'm like, "Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I'm sure from where you're sitting, it looks like I'm making a lot of money." But you should see how much money they're making off of me, you know, and and and and this nimrod in the next cubicle makes 30,000 a year more than I do, and I'm doing my job and half of his, you know, and and before long, you know, I'm the key employee.

I'm the one that that the whole company is hinged on. And next thing you know, they're marching the key employee out to the curb, you know, scratching that unemployed ass. And, you know, and I'm going, how how can you be firing?

You know, I'm the this place will crater without me, you know, but I just I'm discontented. You know, I don't like the way the kids are treating me. I don't like the way my wife's treating me.

You know, you somebody could say good morning and I'm like, "Oh, are you jacking with me already?" You know, and before long, I get this. I need some relief. You know, when I've been sober a little while, I need some relief.

And the book, the doctor's opinion, he says, I'm restless, irritable, and discontented unless I can again experience the sense of ease and comfort. That feeling that comes at once from taking a few drinks. And it says, "Drinks unless I see others taken with impunity." You know what impunity means?

It means they don't get punished for it. They get to have a couple of drinks and it doesn't cost them their job and their car and their old lady and their house and all the values they grew up with and and you know in in their self-respect and their dignity. They just get to have a couple of drinks and when I need relief I start want to know where's mine, where's mine?

How come this nimrod gets to have a couple of pops after work and I don't, you know, and and eventually on, you know, when I need relief bad enough on page 24 it talks about it again. It says a lot starts happening in 23 24 25 26 it says um that I've lost the power of choice and drink my willpower becomes practically non-existent and I am unable at certain times to bring into my conscious with sufficient force the memory of the suffering and humiliation of even a week or a month ago. And that doesn't matter whether it's my suffering and humiliation or my family's suffering and humiliation.

When I need relief, I can't think about it. That's why it always kills me when we have a they go, "We got a new guy. Let's have a step one meeting today." And and and what does everybody talk about?

Instead of pulling this guy with the message of the hope of recovery through this process, everybody talks about all the bad stuff that happened to them when they're drinking. you know, I went to prison 22 times and I started drinking as an embryo and you know, you know, and and you know, DWI like we're going to scare this new guy into getting sober. When on page 24, it tells me that my own stuff won't scare me bad enough to keep me sober.

You know, it's not like I'm going to be when I'm when that's on me. And it's not like I'm going to be in the liquor store and going, "Oh, remember what happened to that guy at the meeting? I don't want any of that.

You know, I'm I'm telling myself it ain't or I may not even think. By the time I take that first drink, it seems like common sense. It seems like the next logical action is to take a drink because I get so uncomfortable, you know.

And you know it goes on to say um once this sort of thinking is fully established in an individual with alcoholic tendencies he's probably placed himself beyond human aid. The thing about it is when I'm working with a new guy my first job is to give him a fatal dose of alcoholism. What I call a step one experience.

And being able to break this stuff down. I can't tell you how many times I've seen guys, you know, the guy that's in treatment for the 15th time and they'll lean forward in their chair just like I did and go, "Hold on just a minute. There's stuff you're saying I've never heard it before." And it explains a lot of stuff that I've never been able to explain.

You know, there's one question that I ask a lot of guys and you know, whenever we would promise people we're never going to drink again and mean it. My family, my people, my work, whatever it is, and I swear to God, this is it. And then they would they'd see us drinking again.

They'd always ask that question. They'd go, "Why did you start drinking again?" And I'd give them the only answer we got, which is what? >> I swear to God, it's like a chorus throughout our fellowship.

I don't know. I don't know. God almighty.

I don't know. You know, it's just what I do. You know, I I just I drink, I guess, and I and I hurt people's feelings and I, you know, and that's what I'm talking about.

When I show up here, I thought there was something wrong with me. And when you see that guy all of a sudden go, the stuff you're saying explains a lot of stuff I've never been able to explain. It explains why whenever I start drinking, it always gets away from me.

And explains why when I stop and by God this time I mean it. You know, this time I I'm serious. I'm never going to that always drink again.

You know, I always say alcoholic synonymous is not for a guy that can make up his mind to stop drinking and pull it off. a guy that can make up his mind to stop drinking doesn't even belong in a I mean they're welcome to come they can drink the coffee and they kind of wish they'd keep their mouth shut and not sponsor anybody but um sorry that was a personal opinion uh because I mean the guys welcome in AA but you know you let a drunk like me roll in you know a year later and what works for that guy might kill a drunk like me because he doesn't have to have a a complete psychic change or a spiritual experience to he can just put the plug in the jug and I don't like to spend a lot of time figuring out whether somebody's a real alcoholic or a hard drinker or that sort of thing. what the book talks about a little bit.

And really most of this stuff, I think the most important thing is to ask myself, what are my current beliefs on this stuff? And are they based on do they match with what the book is saying? The stuff they're saying in the book, where did I get this belief?

And is it consistent with the big book? Well, there is something that happens when all of a sudden I go, what if I'm just a garden variety alcoholic? What if I know I got all these complications and I got things that have happened to me and things that haven't happened to me and and that sort of thing, but what if throughout the middle of that I'm just a garden variety alcoholic and I have a body that can't drink regular and and I got a mind, you know, there is something that happens.

There is a surrender that takes place in that first step experience. And tied to that surrender is a willingness to go through the rest of the work that's not there when my step one is just an academic statement. When I'm going, "Yeah, I'm alcoholic." You know, whatever that means.

I mean, there is something that happens when I break down in my heart that I got this thing and on my own power, I ain't fixing it. You know, on my own, you know, I'm sitting there going, if if I got it the way you're describing it, I got no shot. I got no shot.

It's like getting in a boxing ring with Mike Tyson. You know, I couldn't beat him with a pocketk knife. You know, when you know, for me to try to stop alcoholism with willpower is like trying to stop a freight train with a volleyball net.

It's just woefully inadequate, you know, and and but the thing about that first step experience is it drives the rest of my process through the work. You know, we read in that uh that piece of the book that we read before every meeting, you know, uh how it works. I call it the most often read, least listened to portion of the big book.

That's as close as I came to meditation for a while was, you know, I would go they go rarely have I seen a person fail and boom, I'm out of the room, you know, and then come back in about the time they go, be that God could and would or see that God could and would have sought. in that thing it reads there's they say we stood at the turning point we being you know most of the time this is an interesting thing I never we talk about we who is the we that they're talking about throughout the book and and it's it's describing the founders of our program the people that found it who had had this experience and who found it important enough to put it in book form or people that have experienced the recovery program and had the complete psychic change is the we were talking about you know it says it in the Ford the first edition We of Alcoholics Anonymous are more than 100 men and women who have recovered from a seemingly hopeless state of mind and body. But it always cracks me up.

We'll definitely talk about the chanting in a at some point. But I, you know, it just cracks me, you know, when they read the ninth step promises, you know, and they go, "Are these extravagant promises?" And you got the the guys going, "We think not." And I'm like, "Really? Really?

Those are not extreme. I guess you can just be alone at perfect peace and ease. You know, uh fear of economic insecurities is just gone.

You know, I mean, intuitively know how to handle situations. Damn right those are extravagant promises. You know, on the other side of now it says we think not the people that have had the the psychic change.

But when I'm sitting there, you know, I think when I plop down 10 bucks on a big book, I become part of we, you know, and I'm saying we think not. And in the meantime, my brain is going bing bing bing bing bing bing bing, you know. But the thing about this whole step one experience, it's a very powerful piece of the recovery process, but there's no good news in step one.

There's no happy ending to step one. I mean, you know, if if I explain step one to a guy and he's not a little scared and depressed, either he's not alcoholic or I haven't done a very good job of describing it or he's psychotic, you know, you know, because I mean, this would that would be the short version of I mean, imagine if we if we bring a guy in and we go, "Okay, Bruce, here's the deal. You got a body that ain't regular.

When you drink, it's going to trigger this physical reaction to go off on another run. It's a craving that's way bigger than you are, and over any period of time, it's going to get away from you. You're going to drink a lot more than you can successfully handle.

It's a big problem. Not your biggest problem, though. You also got a mind that's going to get so uncomfortable, it's going to convince you to drink again every time.

Every time. Every time. Really sorry.

Try to have a nice day. But but that's all we'd have if we just had step one, you know. Uh but the first seven pages of working with others does a really good job of describing the first visit with a guy.

And this is a lot of it where it says we talk about we get talking about drinking. I talk about he talks about his drinking. I talk about my drinking.

If he's light, I go with jokes. If he's heavy, I talk about serious stuff. But he tells me how to approach this guy.

And it says at some point of the conversation, we turn the discussion to alcoholism. And he says, "We suggest you do it as we've done it in the chapters on." And that's this stuff we're talking about. You we start talking about that it's not just that I like to party.

It's I got a physical allergy coupled with a mental obsession that adds up to a to a a terrible cycle. You know when it says on that printage 23, it says these observations would be academic and pointless if our friend never took the first drink, thereby setting the terrible cycle in motion. And that's what this graphic is of is of the terrible cycle.

When I'm trapped in that, I'm going to drink at some point and I'm going to trigger this phenomenon of craving and I'm going to drink and I'm going to drink and I'm going to drink and but after I drink for a while, things get really bad and I have to stop. And now I stopped and I'm okay. You know, things are going pretty good.

I got a little folding money in my pocket. I'm back in the big bed. You know, things are, you know, I may not lose the job.

But you know what happens after I don't drink for a while? Things get really bad. And so eventually I have to drink.

So this terrible cycle is I drink until I have to stop and then I stop until I have to drink. And that's the terrible cycle. That that's the seemingly hopeless state of mind.

But I always say if you're stuck in that, there's a bottom below the bottom. You know, whatever you know seems crappy this year, the guy might look back in three years and go, I wish I'd quit in 2013 when things were still going pretty good. You know, I mean, I always tell guys, don't don't ever say it can't get any worse.

You know, all that shows is a lack of imagination. you know, but the reason is but it's interesting that if the book has our whole recovery program laid out in that much of the book, essentially the first 103 pages of the book, it spends that much of it, the first the doctor's opinion in the first 44 pages talking about the problem and then it spends, you know, the next 60 pages talking about the solution. But I mean, they spend almost half the text talking about the problem.

It's so important that I uh that I get that um step one experience because what happens is I start, hey, I actually just circled back around to one. I I drifted away from how it works and I just came back to it. You know, in how it works, we read we stood at the turning point.

The Wii got me thrown off there for a minute. It says, "We stood at the turning point. We asked his protection and care with complete abandon." Do you ever ask yourself what is that turning point?

And it describes it at the bottom of page 25. It says, "If you were as alcoholic as we were, we believe there's no middle-of the road solution." See, if these are state, turn these statements into questions. We were in a position where life was becoming impossible.

And if I'd passed into the region from which there is no return for human aid, I can't stop me. My sponsor can't stop me. My brother, my mother, my probation officer, my best friend, nobody is going to keep me sober on human power.

It says we had but two alternatives. This is the turning point, right? It says, "One was to go on to the bitter end, blotting out the consciousness of my intolerable situation, and the other was to accept spiritual help." That's it.

We talk about that all the time. Does it really come down and do you still believe at 28 years sober, Charlie, that your two choices are die an alcoholic death, live life on a spiritual basis? You know, going to the bitter end, blotting out the consciousness of my intolerable situation, or accept spiritual help.

And the reason I love drunks is we're the only group of people that given those two choices, we go, >> damn. Yeah. Can can you tell me a little more about that bitter end?

You know, I mean, how bitter is it? And cuz I I I I sense that I get to drink on my way to the bitter end, you know? And and the reason you got to hammer this step one with me is because for a drunk like me, when drinking does for you what it did for me, you got to cut off every loophole, every possible avenue of escape, every little cl, every bit ounce of wiggle room for me to be trapped in a hopeless state of mind and body.

And then it says over on page I think it's on 26 27. Oh my god, I love that certain American businessman, you know, um Roland Hazard had gone to Carl Young and well, this is when we're going to start switching into 22, but it's talking about spirit, you know, that we might think we can do without spiritual help. This Roland Hazard story is fantastic.

I mean, he he was a guy that had enough money to burn a wet elephant and and I mean, he he was an investment banker and and and I was married to an investment banker. I know how they the the woman with the place in the Hamptons. This guy when he realized he had a drinking problem, he went to see Carl Young.

I say it'd be like going to see, you know, Dr. Phil or Deepo Chopra now or something. I got a problem.

I'm going to the big guy, you know. And he gets on a boat and goes to Switzerland. He spends 45 days with him and he has and he learns a lot about the inner springs of his mind and that sort of thing and it's see if this sounds like one of us getting out of treatment.

He says though experience had made him skeptical he finished his treatment with unusual confidence. His physical and mental condition were unusually good. Above all he believed he'd acquired such a profound knowledge of the inner workings of his mind and its hidden springs that relapse was unthinkable.

Nevertheless, he was drunk in a short time. You know the story is that guy didn't even make it back to the boat. You know, they they found him, the way I understand it, they found him on a train in Spain, you know, drunk off his ass.

And they bring him back to Carl Young and he's asking about it and Carl Young says, um, he was utterly hopeless. This is a awful doctor's visit. You know, you know, he says, uh, he'd have to be locked up or have a bodyguard.

And uh and he goes, you know, he goes on to say, "Some of our readers may think they can do without spiritual help." Let us tell you the rest of the conversation. The doctor says, "You got the mind of a chronic alcoholic." That's what we've just been talking about. You know, the difference between a moderate drinker, hard drinker, real alcoholic.

He goes, "Check this out for a doctor's visit." He says, "I've never seen one single case recover. And he and he says what any good drunk would say. He goes, "Is there no exception, you know, come on, man.

This is old Charlie here, you know, I mean, you know, is there?" And the doctor says, he goes, "Well, here and there once in a while, we've seen people have these spiritual experiences." You know, this is rolling into step two now, but he, you know, he says, "To me, they're phenomenon." He goes, "They appear to be in the nature of huge emotional displacements and rearrangements. Ideas, emotions, and attitudes which were once the guiding forces of the lives of these men are suddenly cast to one side and a completely set of con new set of conceptions and motives begin to dominate them." So, Carl Young understood the problem. He told the guy he's a chronic alcoholic and he even knew what the solution was.

He says there these vital but he didn't know how to make it happen. I was I was I've been organizing an AA golf tournament in Austin for 27 years. We used to have the legends of golf.

The whole seniors tour was born in Austin and so I came up with the legends of sobriety and it was really clever when we had the legends of golf but it's been gone for 15 years so it's just a stupid name for a golf tournament now. One day we're having the tournament and and the the marshall comes up and you know he's the guy that is in a little cart and he's supposed to keep everybody moving and make sure you're not driving on the greens and you know that sort of thing. And the marshall comes up and we're all kind of waiting at this one hole and he knows that we're in AA golf tournament and I'll never forget it.

He comes up and he goes, "So you guys are AA?" I said, "Yeah." And we started talking. He goes, "My dad was a drunk." He goes, "My dad was the the angriest, most awful man you'd ever want to be around. and he was a racist.

He was a bigot. He was just mad at everybody and drank every day of his life and you know and just he goes and then he was in his 60s. He was in his late 60s and he got really really sick and the whole family went he went into a coma and he said the whole family went down to the hospital and we're around his bed and uh he's laying in the bed.

and he's completely unconscious and he says all of a sudden both his hands went up in the air like this and he's holding his hands up in the air and he starts talking to people that we can't see and he's talking about world hunger and ending world hunger. He's talking about world peace and stuff like that. And then he goes, "I have to leave you now, but a better man is coming to take my place." Boom.

Both his hands just dropped down to the bed and they thought he was dead. He wasn't dead. He comes out of the coma and for the rest of his life, he never takes another drink of alcohol.

The racism's gone. The bigotry is gone. The anger's gone.

Sweetest guy you could ever hope to be around. Keeps a bottle of whiskey under the kitchen sink in case company comes over. Never touches a drop of it for the rest of his life.

Complete psychic change. Vital spiritual experience. But imagine the powerlessness that Dr.

Young was feeling when he's talking to Roland Hazard saying, "We got to get you one of those." You know, I got no idea how to make it happen. But but well, that's what makes AA a big deal is that we understand the problem. We know what the solution is and we have a program of action that will bring about the solution every time.

You know, in the 12th step, it says, "Having had a spiritual awakening." The only shot that a drunk like me has got is the spiritual awakening. The book describes it as a spiritual awakening, a spiritual experience, uh a personality change sufficient to overcome drinking, a change of heart, whatever it is, something big has got to happen for a drunk like me to stop getting loaded for a month, much less, you know, 28 years or permanently. And we have a program of action.

It says having had a spiritual awakening as the result of these steps. So it's telling me that the result my only shot is the result the result of these steps will bring about the only thing that'll help a drunk like me. And the thing that amazes me is now you know so many people out there I was talking at breakfast with some guys.

So many people come into AA, they come into a 12step program now and we don't work the 12 steps. You know, for a whole bunch of us, this AA thing is going to those meetings and not drinking. And that works really good.

If you're drunk like me, going to meetings and and not works right up to the point that I either drink or blow my brains out, you know. So this I really was saying at breakfast I really believe and I wouldn't put this in a grape vine or anything but I think people in our fellowship that have worked all 12 steps are in the minority. I I I think there's very you know there's a whole bunch of us that have so I like talking about it but I mean if you if I had this terminal cancer that's untreatable and they go they go is there no exception?

and they said, "Well, there's a study they're doing up in Seattle, um, where they're having about a 90% success rate, but we don't really know what they're doing." You know, I mean, you wouldn't be able to keep me out of Seattle, you know? I mean, I'd be selling my house to move to Seattle, but I I come in here and I go, I think I'll just work on me for a minute or, you know, you know, that sort of thing. So, so I I like to talk about the importance of this step one, but it drives me in.

You know, I don't generally the the chapter we agnostics, I'm really talking about one and two here, and we're almost done. The thing about one and two. Now, the the chapter we agnostics is one of the most powerful pieces of spiritual literature out there.

I mean, there is some real depth to that to that chapter, but it talks an awful lot about laying aside prejudice and looking at my old ideas and asking myself where did they come from and you know and but the really I don't generally spend a tremendous amount of time in step two with a new guy because I love that line on page 27 because after Carl Young has or 28 it says here was the terrible dilemma in which our friend found himself when he had the extraord extraordinary experience which as we have already told you made him a free man. We in our turn sought the same escape with the desperation of a drowning man. That step one experience tied to that desperation is a willingness that drives me through the rest of the work.

You know, if I'm down to die an alcoholic death, live life on a spiritual basis, this this solution gets really interesting. I don't know why I'd be interested in a power greater than myself when I still think my power will get the job done. But the moment that I understand in my core that on my own shot I got no chance on my own power I got no shot then this power gets real interesting.

You know then I start talking about you know when it says we in our turn sought the same escape with the desperation of a drowning man. The thing I love about drowning men is they don't ask a lot of questions, you know. It's like you pull up and I'm drowning, I'm not going to go.

Tell me about your experience with working with drowning men. You know, uh, you know, I used to think it was really important that I knew what we were going to do, how it's going to go, what it's going to feel like while we're doing it, and what the end result is going to be. And I thought it was really important that I approve of the whole process.

When I got that desperation of a drowning man, all you're going to hear out of me is, "What do you want me to do?" And the next thing you're going to hear is, "Okay, I did that. Now, what do you want me to do?" That's when we get this deal going, but we're not going anywhere until I really am driven by this flamethrower at my ass of, you know, Bill used to say, "We got two ultimate authorities in AA. We got uh my mother goes to church just for spiritual thirst.

We have two driving factors. One is God saying come close to me and I'll take care of you. But we also got whiskey saying if you screw around with this bill too much I'll kill you.

You know so it's like not all of my spiritual endeavor is just out of thirst for being a better guy. There's some survivalist stuff in there, you know, and that's and that's driven by this step one experience. Do I believe this is my only shot?

Well, um I'm we're going to talk we're going to roll into step three after the break. Uh but I can't tell you the the the power of being able to break this stuff down. I mean, you know, being able to sit down with a new guy and being properly armed with the facts about myself, you can set the hook.

This is where we set the hook in that first visit. And then it talks about suppose now you're making your second visit to this guy. He's read this book.

He says he's ready to go through with the program of recovery. That's where we find ourselves on a second and then we let him have it, you know. So, uh, let's take about a 15minute break and, uh, and get back in here, guys.

Thanks. >> Thank you for listening to Sober Sunrise. If you enjoyed today's episode, please give it a thumbs up as it will help share the message.

Until next time, have a great day.