Welcome to Sober Sunrise, a podcast bringing you AA speaker meetings with stories of experience, strength, and hope from around the world. We bring you several new speakers weekly, so be sure to subscribe. We hope to always remain an ad-free podcast, so if you'd like to help us remain self-supporting, please visit our website at sober-onrise.com.

Whether you join us in the morning or at night, there's nothing better than a sober sunrise. We hope that you enjoy today's speaker. Hey there everybody.

I am Matt Cass. I'm a grateful recovered alcoholic and uh just cuz I don't get the Hey Matt. Just a thumbs up from a few people if I'm from from you can hear me good.

All right, sweet. That's all I'm looking for. It's uh All right.

That's not all I'm looking for. I'm always looking for feedback from people. Um but uh no it's uh I was sharing before the meeting started you know the uh I just finished another fourstep inventory.

So obviously I did the uh the fear portion of it and I'm still amazed after uh almost 24 years of sobriety how often the uh you know the uh the need to be accepted and need to be uh you know love still pops up as you know character defects you know so sometimes quickly sometimes slowly you know but uh as I said my name is Matt Cassidy I am a grateful recovered alcoholic as it says in the big book I should be introduced that way my home group is alone with love and service group of alcoholics anonymous we meet on Tuesdays and Thursday nights at 8:00 in Ridge New This is Suffach County, Low Island. So, if you find yourself in area, please stop on by. We'd love to have you.

We uh fellowship's good, coffee is not so good, but you know, you can partake in both. Hopefully, we see you. Uh I do have a sponsor, Dave F.

Uh he more importantly, he knows that he sponsors me. We do have an active uh sponsorship relationship and I do actively sponsor people. So, I'm involved in all three sides of our triangle, which I was taught is how you stay so, you know, sober and happy in the fellowship of Alcoholics Anonymous.

you know, the uh you know, I always start off with the fact that, you know, like I said, my last name is Cassie. I'm Irish on both sides of the fence. You know, uh my mom's Irish, my dad's Irish, and in both sides of the family, you know, if you're not alcoholic, you marry one just so you can fit in.

You know, I'm I am grateful for that because, you know, if it was not for a uh a sick family like that, you know, I would not be able to fit in with the uh with the type of drinking I did before I got sober. You know, it uh probably would have been a lot more frowned upon if they weren't as sick as they are, you know. And just uh if you need any proof for that, you know, the um I always share that one, you know, one of my uncles just died of cerosis of the liver, but whenever anybody in the family talks about Uncle Bush, they always say, "Oh, he died of an infection." You know, cuz if we talked about, you know, what he actually died of, then we would have to acknowledge the fact that he literally drank himself to death.

Um I have another uncle who's bouncing in and out of sober houses right now cuz he can't stay sober. He lost his, you know, he lost his job due to his drinking. He lost his marriage due to his drinking.

Um, you know, and he uh I last time I I've been to several family functions, I haven't seen him in well over a year, you know, but uh when we when they talk about Uncle Frankie, they just talk about how he's down on his luck and hopefully, you know, how his luck will change. But that's even when anybody talks about him because they rarely do because if they did, then they would have to talk about how alcoholism is, you know, controlling his life. So the uh my family never talks about the elephant in the room, you know, when it comes to alcoholism, which is why it's uh, you know, so uh, you know, so accepted, you know.

um at a very early age you know the uh my mother went into Alanon when I was 8 years old you know and the uh you know she sat down and started talking to us about a 12step fellowship that she belonged to and you know she started explaining to us you know what was going to come of all that you know and the uh you know she tells the story and it's probably true because you know you know she uh she didn't kill a lot of brain cells with uh you know with drinking and uh you know substance abuse like I did so I'll take her at her word you know when she said when we sat down you know and she went to tell us about you know my dad's alcohol ISM, you know, she tried to tell us, you know, how sick he was and the uh you know, according to her, you know, you know, I was like, yeah, you know, I knew what the problem was right away that dad drank too much. So, apparently I can spot alcoholism from a mile away, you know, even even before I started showing all the symptoms of it. You know, the um I do also remember, you know, the first time she took us to one of her meetings, you know, she had told us it was a 12step program.

And I remember we uh you know they they had a daycare down in the basement you know where you could drop the kids off you know because a lot of the Alanon women needed you know babysitters so they can go to their day meetings. And I remember walking down the steps and I remember counting the steps and there was more than 12 steps. So I was like I felt like I was getting mixed messages you know when it came to Alanon is a 12step program cuz there's more than 12 steps here you know was mom maybe you know mistaken or something.

So uh you know even at an early age I guess you know um you know overanalyzing was part of you know it's part of my uh you know makeup. you know the um I also do share just because it is part of my uh you know story you know the I was sexually abused by a next-door neighbor at 8 years old and the only reason why I share that is because you know the growing up with an alcoholic father who was abusive you know both mentally you know as well as verbally and physically you know and also being abused by a next-door neighbor you know all that stuff combined you know made me at a really early age decide that if there was a god I didn't want to have anything to do with him you know so uh it was it wasn't until I wound up in the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous that I would, you know, form that relationship with a God of my understanding, you know, whom whom is loving, whom is caring, who is forgiving, who is, you know, all-encompassing, you know, I would not find that God until I wound up in AA, you know. So, at a young age, even though I was an alter boy and, you know, the one thing I liked about being an alter boy is that you could drink the church wine prior to the mass starting.

It wasn't yet consecrated. So, you know, it uh you know, it wasn't uh I didn't look it as cheating, you know, the um you know, but uh I did have exposure to drinking, you know, as a kid and but I did not want to be alcoholic. I remember being, you know, making that promise as a young kid that I didn't want to be alcoholic.

You know, the uh I did I did try and fill that God-shaped hole with many other things before I found alcohol. You know, when I was in high school, you know, uh before, you know, uh in my junior year, I was 5'8", 260 lbs. you know, so obviously food was a uh, you know, was a good thing to turn to before I found alcohol.

You know, I did not want to be an alcoholic, but when I was introduced to a leafy green substance called marijuana, you know, it says on page 31 of the big book that we used, you know, many things to try and, you know, uh, you know, control our drinking. And I know today that I used, you know, marijuana to control my drinking because I had I didn't want to be an alcoholic, but I had no problem being labeled a pthead. I mean, go figure, you know.

So uh you know but you know just fast forwarding you know to you know to get to the drinking because you know I do have to share in a general way what it used to be like what I used to be like what happened and what I'm like now you know so uh I don't want to spend too much long you know too long on drinking because it is only onethird of you know the story I'm supposed to be sharing but you you fast forward to my senior year of high school and that's the first time I it's the first time I ever got drunk. You know, I remember I being at a party, you know, at a next-door neighbor's house, you know, and the uh, you know, I was drinking from a glass because, you know, I just intuitively knew that if you, you know, if you drink if you pound it from a bottle, that would be alcoholic. And I didn't want to be alcoholic, like I said.

So, I was drinking from a glass so I could look, you know, a little bit high class, you know. And the uh, you know, I remember dropping I remember dropping the glass and it hitting the floor and it shattering to pieces, you know. I remember everybody looking at me and I remember the first thought was how embarrassed I was you know because you know I still hadn't you know I still couldn't get over that you know restless discontent I still hadn't gotten over that feeling of you know being a part of you know so you know they so they all looked at me I felt embarrassed and then I felt mad that I had dropped my drink but then the next thought was don't worry it's going to be okay you know because you know the uh you know because the phenomenon of craving had already set in you know at that point in my drinking career You know, I had already know I had already, you know, I could already see that, you know, when I put it in my body, I needed more.

I had an abnormal reaction, you know, to alcohol that normal people do not. You know, I am married to a non-alcoholic, you know, wife and, you know, so when I watch my wife drink it to this, you know, I've been with her, you know, uh, almost 17 years and it still puzzles me, you know, she'll take a drink and, you know, she'll be like, "Ew, I don't like the taste of it." And not finish it, you know. I'm like, you know, so you drink for taste?

That's weird. You know, and then she'll, you know, she'll drink and, you know, she'll uh, you know, she'll start to get a buzz and she'll stop drinking. She'll she'll just at the at the drop of a dime, she'll stop drinking, you know.

She'll she'll stop right on that dime. I'll be like, "What what are you doing? What's the matter?" "Oh, I'm starting to feel it, you know." So, I'm like, "Um, but sweetheart, the buzz is the beginning of the race.

It's not supposed to be the finish line. You're supposed to keep on going." You know, it just, like I said, I look at her drinking just makes no sense to me. You know, I, you know, I think alcoholic is the only normal way, you know.

But, uh, you know, my drinking didn't, you know, my drinking came with a lot of consequences. But consequences is, you know, if you are a real alcoholic, you know, it doesn't stop you. You can always rationalize, you know, the next morning, you know, you know, how it wasn't your fault, how it wasn't alcohol's fault, how it was their fault, or you were in just in the wrong place at the wrong time.

You know, the um, you know, my father was a police officer. He was involved in law enforcement, you know, and as a result of that, you know, I did almost get arrested once for possession. I got away with it because, you know, dad was a police officer and the next morning I woke up, it was just bad luck.

Actually, I should finish that whole story, you know, because my my mom is actually listening in on this because, you know, she loves when her sober son gets to speak for an AA meeting. You know, the uh you know, the one thing she told us, you know, when she knew I you know, she my mom grew up in the 60s, so she could spot a pthead from a mile away. You know, even though I thought I was hiding it, you know, she also grew up, you know, she never t she's never taken a breath without alcoholism being in the picture cuz her dad was alcoholic.

She married an alcoholic and she's got three alcoholic sons, you know. You know, so one thing she said to us one night was, you know, she goes, "I just, you know, you're going to do whatever you're going to do. I got no control over that." And she said, "But just do me a favor.

Never get brought home by the police." And I, you know, okay, you got it, mom. No problem. And I couldn't even keep that promise because I did get, you know, that night I almost got arrested.

I got brought home by the police. And, you know, so my mom was upstairs sleeping cuz that's what, you know, normal people do at, you know, 1:00 in the morning, you know, they sleep, you know. So I had to go upstairs and I had to wake my mom up to tell her that there's a police officer downstairs, you know.

And as she jumped out of bed, you know, like the house was on fire. Not because, you know, she didn't even know was going on yet, but like I said, the the stuff that I put people through, what I know today is that her first thought was that something happened to her husband at work. You know, so she thought she was walking down the stairs to find out that she was a widow, you know.

Instead, she walks downstairs to find out that a knucklehead son almost got arrested for possession and her other knucklehead son almost got arrested for, you know, public intoxication, you know. So, uh, you know, when I woke up the next morning, you know, all that remorse and and guilt and stuff, you know, it's that if consequences sobered people up, that the feeling the next morning would have been enough to probably, you know, make me want to stop. But instead, if you're as alcoholic as I am, you could probably identify with those were the exact reasons why I needed to drink.

I needed to go back to something in order to get rid of those feelings because if I, you know, because alcohol, you know, numbs that stuff, you know, it gets right, it changes the way I get to look at reality. you know, so uh you know, I the um you know, like when when they announced, you know, you know, there anybody visiting from out of town, you guys heard, you know, some of my buddies from Kansas, I go to a meeting on Monday, a Zoom meeting Monday night in Kansas. you know, there's a couple people on here from Canada because, you know, I go to a Wednesday night Zoom meeting in, you know, in Alberta, Canada, you know, so, you know, so you guys heard a whole bunch of my new Zoom friends, you know, thanks to this pandemic, you know, and uh it wasn't always that way because, you know, the another time I almost got in trouble, you know, the uh you know, was I got pulled over for what should have been a DWI at the time.

I was only 19 years of age, okay? So, I should have got, you know, I should have gotten arrested for DWI as well as underage drinking and I did have open container in a car. So, you know, my rap sheet, you know, should have been a hell of a lot longer than, you know, but uh again, you know, when dad's in law enforcement, they, you know, they let me off the hook.

And, you know, I I still remember to this day because I came out of, you know, the nothing like, you know, flashing red lights and the wailing of a police siren behind you to bring you out of a perfectly good blackout, you know. So, I wasn't in a blackout when the cop pulled me over, you know, and what, you know, I remember what he said to me was, you know, he gave me two options when he found out, you know, you know, what occupation my dad was in. He said, "You can number one call a cab or number two call somebody to come pick you up, you know." And I said, "Yes, sir." And he I I agreed.

And he said, "If I see you driving," he said, "If I see you driving on the way home, I will, you know, at this time I will arrest you. So don't let me see you drive." And I said, "Yes, sir." You know, and he left. And I was remember s I was sitting there in the parking lot in the parked car looking at a perfectly good pay phone that worked.

And I couldn't for the life of me think of one person who really gave a crap about me that if I called would come and help me. And nor could I call a cab to come get me because at this point I was living paycheck to paycheck. And most of my paycheck was going to alcohol.

So I couldn't I couldn't afford a cab to call and nor could I think of anybody to call, you know. So when it talks about in the big book the feeling of loneliness, you know, that was about as lonely as you know as I think I ever felt, you know, in this world. And you know, like I said, today if anything ever happened to me, if I found myself on the side of the road at 2 in the morning, you know, modern technology, I wouldn't have to look at a pay phone.

I could use, you know, break out the old cell phone. And in that cell phone, I have, you know, probably well over 100 contacts of people who come and help me, you know, because of the fellowship of Alcoholics Anonymous, you know. So, you know, it's uh, you know, it's those consequences don't, you know, never sobered me up, you know.

It was it was definitely, you know, just, you know, it was like again when I woke up the next morning, it was wrong place, wrong time. If I took a different route home, I wouldn't have got pulled over. You know, if I had just been driving down that street 5 minutes, you know, later, I wouldn't have gotten pulled over, you know.

So, you know, it was wasn't my fault. It wasn't alcohol's fault. And, you know, the dance continued.

You know the uh you know the other thing that you know I I just like to share before I move on to you know you know what happened you know is the uh you know like I said my mom was in Alanon and one morning you know I I come down the steps after a long night of drinking and you know you know another blackout was involved and you know so I I have no idea what the hell I did the night before. You know I my I was 19 when I got sober so I did a lot of my drinking in my parents house. you know, the uh you know, the my I turned my my parents' bedroom, you know, into a dorm room essentially.

I had a fridge in there and you know, like a good alcoholic when I would get the you know, when I get the new stuff, you'd have to rotate stock. You know, the new stuff would have to go in the back. You know, you got to keep the cold ones up front.

So, you know, I had a little beer distributor/dorm room going on in my parents house. You know, the just total disrespect and disregard for, you know, who paid the mortgage and whose house it actually was, you know, cuz selfishness and self-centerness is the root of my problem, you know. So I come downstairs, you know, one morning and my mom's like, you know, she's like, "I want you to sit down.

I want to talk to you." So, you know, she what she was doing was, you know, she she was doing some of, you know, she had to do what she had to do to feel good, you know, she had to get off her chest, you know, some of the stuff that, you know, was, you know, going around in her head, you know, so she wanted to talk to me about my drinking and, you know, she she wasn't looking to get me sober, you know, she had enough Alanon under her belt by that point to know that, you know, anything she said to me wouldn't have an effect, you know. So, but she just had to get off, you know, her chest what was going on in between her ears, you know, and the only thing I remember, you know, is, you know, from it is like she wanted to talk about feelings and feelings to me were just a foreign language, you know. It's like you talk to me about, you know, feelings.

It's I'm just like I I don't know what you're talking about. It's just like, you know, the only feeling I could ever identify was if you talked about, you know, a feeling called yik, you know, cuz that's how I felt on a daily basis. You know, I just, you know, I woke up, you know, and felt yik every day, you know, and, you know, that to me was normal.

So you talked about anger, you you talked about sadness, you talked about, you know, anything else. I was just completely lost, you know, but that's some of the stuff she wanted to talk about. And what I remember is that, you know, the last thing she said to me was, you know, if you were not my son, I would throw you out, you know.

So again, consequences of, oh my god, I could become homeless and, you know, I don't have a, you know, I'm about to get fired from a job, so I'll become, you know, unemployed also. You know, it was just none of that stuff crossed my mind. All that went through my mind was, oh, biologically I'm a son, so she's not going to throw me out.

So again, you know, off the hook, you know, I just totally like disregarded everything that she had to say because again, selfish and self- centerness is the root of my problem. It's always about me and I'm safe because I'm not going to get thrown out. You know, my drinking did continue for a few months past that.

You know, the uh my my last my last drunk was absolutely nothing exciting to be quite honest. You know, my last drunk all it did was prove to me the last piece of the puzzle that I would need to have a have a moment of clarity. you know, that God-given moment where I could see things as they actually were.

You know, I was leaving for a party that was going to happen. You know, it was about an hour and a half drive from my house and I was sitting in my driveway and I was going to not drink that night. Not because I didn't want to drink that night.

I was not going to drink that night because by that point, everybody in my life was calling me alcoholic except for me, you know. So, every you know that Matt, you got a drinking problem, Matt. We think you're alcoholic.

Matt, you should do something about your drinking. You know, co you know, co-workers, family, everybody but me. He knew, you know, knew what knew what the deal was.

So, I needed to prove to all of these people that I was not alcoholic. You know, by this point, the party that I was going to, it's not because I was invited, okay? It's because of who my brother was.

My brother was, you know, part of that crew and I was just there as a hanger honor. Okay? So, I was going to this party and I was not going to drink because I was going to prove to everybody that I was not alcoholic.

If you have to prove to people you're not alcoholic, you should probably take a look at that because chances are when everybody's calling you alcoholic and you don't think you're one, you're probably wrong. But I'm not here to label anybody. I can just share my story, you know.

So I leave my driveway with the full intention of not drinking that night. And then what happened to me was about 40 minutes later as I hit the county line, okay, the next county line, the thought pops into my head. And what I know today was it was that strange mental blank spot.

was that mental obsession. Okay, it wasn't even a thought. It's not like I had to rationalize it.

It just popped up like it was magic. Like one minute I got my eyes on the road and not rear ending the guy in front of me. And the next second what pops in my head is but it's if it's a six-hour party and we buy one six-pack and we drink one beer an hour.

That's not alcoholic. That's social drinking. So you can still drink and it will not and you can still prove to everybody that you're not alcoholic.

And what I know today is that's that mental blank spot. That's the mental obsession whose job it is to lie to me that this time it's going to be different. This time I'll be able to control and enjoy my drinking.

And I bought into it full force. So the first thing I did when I parked the car, you know, at the party was take a walk to the beer, you know, take take a walk to the place that, you know, sold underage kids beer, okay? And b, you know, bought myself a six-pack.

I walked into the party. I ripped off all the ripped off all the labels, put them in the fridge, and then you know, and then said to uh you know, I made this grandiose announcement because, you know, I don't know about you people, but in my mind, when I talk, everybody listens and is going to do exactly what I want. Okay?

So, I share with all of them that I bought a six-pack. It's my beer. Nobody drink my beer, okay?

And I won't drink your beer. Okay? Every, you know, and everyone's like, "Oh, yeah, yeah, okay, whatever." You know, in my mind, they said, "Yeah, okay, whatever." But, you know, chances are they didn't even, you know, hear a damn thing I said because, you know, you know, I'm not I'm not that important.

Okay. So, I'm at the party and I'm nursing my first beer and I'm I I I was not having any fun at all. You know, if I'm supposed to control and enjoy my drinking, as the book says, then I should have been able to do both at the same time.

But here I was controlling my drinking and I was not enjoying at all. And I remember somebody walked past me and they had a beer without a label on it and I knew it was mine. And I was like, "Okay, these people don't listen to me." Okay.

Now, now I can't even keep track of what I'm going to drink. So, screw it. I'll just I'll just drink.

Okay. And again, there's that strange mental blank spot coupled with, okay, the physical allergy because I'd already put some in my body and I was off to the races again, you know? And the uh when I woke up the next morning, like I said, it wasn't anything spectacular.

All it was was a thought that crossed my mind that was like, "What happened to the the promise that I was not going to drink. It was nowhere to be found. I didn't know yet what had happened to me because I hadn't had exposure to Alcoholics Anonymous.

I hadn't yet had exposure to the big book, you know, which explains what my problem is." Okay. All I knew is that I made a promise and I couldn't keep it. And the outcome was another night of drunken stupidity and another blackout and another and another night of like, "Oh crap." you know, what did I do?

And most importantly, does anybody know that I don't remember? Because blackouts for me were embarrassing because like I said, I grew up with an Allenon. So, I knew what a blackout was even before I had my first blackout.

So, when I had my first blackout, I was like, that's a red flag that, you know, that, you know, should have been, you know, seen along the way. But, of course, it wasn't, you know. So, it was uh it was it was I wanted about I need a twoe period.

So it's between that that morning I woke up that was May the 5th of 1996 like I said that is my sobriety date to this date like Charlie you know Charlie said the uh you know he got sober March 96 I followed and you know by God's good grace and good sponsorship and the 12 steps I'm still following him behind him by two months you know so uh you know God God is not good God is great you know when you know when you let him in your life and he uh but I needed I needed I had a twoe convincer because I thought I could still control it by myself I thought I could just not drink because I didn't want to And you know again what I found is there I was not drinking but I was not happy not doing it. Okay. So I was just I was not happy being sober.

It's just I was all I was was I was dry. You know I know today you know what what I was experiencing was what it talks about in the doctor's opinion is I had a relief from the physical allergy. I had a relief because I wasn't putting alcohol in my system.

So I had relief from onethird of my illness. But what I know today is that I was still suffering from the other two/3s. I just didn't know it.

So at this time I was also hanging around the rooms of Alanon because like I said my mom was in Alanon and I knew something was going on you know and I so I thought my dad's drinking was the problem. If I went to Alanon then I could be okay. So one of the things they suggest in Alanon is go to open AA meetings.

So I had been attending open AA meetings and you know when when I go to those things it's like the funny thing was I I felt like I fit in you know but I rationalized it. Oh well it's an open AA meeting so anybody can come in there. So they must cater open meetings so that everybody feels like they're part of.

So that's you know what I chocked it up to, you know. So um I found myself at an Allen conference and when the AA speaker came up to speak, I found myself nodding in agreement with the AA speaker. So again, there should have been another red flag along the way that you know was you know was unseen you know but uh so what happened was when I wound up in my first closed meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous and they were like this is a closed meeting of Alcoholics Anonymous.

It's here for those who have a desire to stop drinking. I was like, "Oh boy, you know, either I belong or I don't, you know, so um you know, the uh when it came my turn to share when like is there anybody new, you know, who needs, you know, so I raised my hand and you know, so I started sharing and and I remember still to this day my my first share in AA is, you know, I'm Matt and I'm an alcoholic. I I don't know if I'm an alcoholic, but I know I have a drinking problem." And I went on to spew about, you know, tried to explain my drinking and, you know, and maybe they they could tell me how I was different or maybe they could tell me how I didn't belong.

And when I was done, you know, the all the speaker had to say was the only feedback he gave, you know, was the um Matt, if you think you're alcoholic, you probably are alcoholic because non-alcoholics don't sit around wondering if they're alcoholic. And I was like, oh crap. So I knew like the jig was up, you know.

So there I was sitting in the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous now, you know, now knowing and believing I'm an alcoholic. The very next meeting I went to, I did introduce myself as I'm mad. I am an alcoholic.

you know, and the uh you know, because you know, was the uh you know, I get you know, that's what you do when you know, when you you know, when you're an AA, you introduce yourself as an alcoholic and you know, and like I said, the jig was up. But um you know what happened to me was like I said I came in I was 19 years of age you know I was surrounded by you know a whole bunch of other young people and the the young people crowd I was running around with there is you know and the the AA that I was exposed to you know when I first got sober here on Long Island was it was it was a whole bunch of just don't drink go to meetings 90 meetings in 90 days meeting makers make it you know it was a whole bunch of cliches that sounded good but they nobody I was sitting in the rooms of AA just not getting better, you know, and I couldn't figure out why, you know, it's like I, you know, you, like I said, you know, God willing, the creeks don't rise and, you know, in, uh, you know, in 9 days I'll have 24 years and I've still never made it 90 and 90 cuz I that's not that's not mandatory in order to stay sober, you know. So, um, but what I was getting was just all these oneline cliches that just did not have any kind type of solution behind them, you know.

Like, uh, Charlie said, you know, we bumped into each other. It was a, you know, you fast forward 2 months later. So, I'm about 100 days sober sitting in the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous dying of untreated alcoholism because what has never happened to me is I've never taken the 12 steps.

I had had, you know, I knew that it was a 12step fellowship. I knew there were 12 steps. Like I said, I've had exposure to a 12step program since I was 8 years old.

And it's so I wanted to take the 12 steps. And I was I I remember to this day I was told by somebody I was like I was like, I want to do a fourth and a fifth step. And somebody told me, well, you're not sober enough to do a fourth and fifth step.

You got to wait to do that stuff, you know. So, it's it's people like that who, you know, it's like they may be well-intentioned, but it was people like that that I was hanging around with the wrong type of crowd and I was getting the wrong message, you know. So, when you fast forward, you know, August of 96, you know, I moved down to Greensboro, North Carolina, okay?

Cuz I went to go back to college. I had already done a year of of college in Greensboro. I did, you know, like I say, UNCCG saw me one year drunk and what saw me one year sober, you know.

So my first year down there, that's where my drinking, you know, it was just, you know, was completely insane, you know. It was like I remember, you know, the uh when I first started drinking like seriously in college, you know, it's like it didn't take long for people to tell me, you know, that's like Matt, we love you, but when you drink, we can't stand you. You know, you just turn into somebody completely different.

So what what they were already seeing was that Dr. Jackekal and Mr. Hide that the big book talks about.

So again, people long people long before I knew what was going on knew what was going on with me, you know, but uh so when I found myself in Greensboro, North Carolina, you know, the uh first of all, you all had that southern hospitality, you know, and you still do cuz when I wound up in serendipity two weeks ago, you all welcome me with open arms and God, did I just say y'all? I'm like fitting right back in again. All right.

the uh you know the um but yeah it's like it's like that that you guys had that southern hospitality where you welcome me right in and you know the uh you know oh you you're down here you're visiting and stuff you know come on in you know you know you know and I just I just felt welcome you know and I felt more welcomed you know sitting in the rooms of AA down you know down with you guys than I did you know in my own home group at first you know and then what what I started to notice is that everybody was you know you guys did crazy stuff like when it was a big book meeting, you showed up with your own big book. You know, the people I was hanging out with would show up to a big book meeting and like all the big books would disappear from the front of the room and a new guy like me who didn't have his own big book would be sitting there trying to follow along and listen, you know, and uh but like I said, not only did you all carry a big book, but all you guys, you know, quoted the big book, you lived the big book. You know, the message you carried was one of depth and weight.

And that's that when I came down to North Carolina, that was the missing ingredient to getting well, you know, was actually finding out about the 12 steps. You know, I I came down there thinking because I had 100 days sober, I get to sponsor shop. I get I get to pick who's going to work with me, you know, I get to pick who the lucky human being that, you know, who I call to be the sponsor was, you know, and uh you know, but God's got a sense of humor and you know, he threw another one of those little miracles in my life.

You know, I met a guy by the name of Joe J. you know, he would become my sponsor in, you know, North Carolina. He'd be the one who took he would be the one who'd take me through the 12 steps for the first time.

You know, I remember him sitting in the back of a room, you know, sharing that he got sober at 19. I'm like, "Hey, that's me and him. We got that in common." I remember him sharing about, you know, how at first he didn't believe in a, you know, in a god and he was confused and he, you know, could have been part agnostic and I'm like, "Hey, that's me.

I could identify with that, you know, you know, and then and then he shared until the day he, you know, realized that there was a God of his understanding who could love him and take care of him on a daily basis and, you know, save him from alcoholism that he could be he could be recovered and he goes and you know how he started crying when he realized that and I was like crying's a little too much, you know, but everything else he said I liked, you know. So I went up to him and I asked to be my sponsor and like I said he took you know he took me in the back of the unity club you know and uh you know he cracked open a big book because again you know there he had one I didn't you know he cracked it he cracked it open you know and showed me that you know the story the name of the book alcoholics anonymous the story how many many thousand men of recovered from alcoholism he was the first person who showed me that I could get well from this deal that I would not forever be sick you know that I would not be recovering my entire life you know so uh you know and then he started talking about the 12 steps because he said, you know, I'm going to take you through the 12 steps. We're going to get together.

We're going to read the book. You know, we're going to, you know, we're going to get involved and we're going to get you, you know, he threw me into service work. You know, you know, I made the mistake one night of saying I was bored.

And he said, well, there's a whole bunch of other young people trying to put together a conference. Why don't you get involved with that? And I was like, oh boy.

You know, he his other introduction to service work, you know, I was like, I always tell the story. I was like, I thought I was doing a good job because I would dump out my ashtray. I would throw out my coffee cup and I would push in my chair at the end of the meeting.

And then I would come to find out that all that meant is that my mother raised me, right? You know, his idea of service was to throw out somebody else's coffee cup, dump out somebody else's ashtray, push in a chair, and then not look for an attab boy at the end of it. That you're going to do something for somebody else and not look for anything in return.

And I was like, uh, you know, I was like, and you know, the other thing that he sold me on, you know, is that AA never knocked on my door for membership. I wound up in the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous because everything I tried did not work. If there was anything that I could do to stop drinking and it would have and be happy about it and it would have worked and I would not be sitting in the rooms of AA.

He pointed out that AA was the last stop on the block and that the only thing that they had to offer to get well was the 12 steps, you know. And I remember sitting there with him and I was like, I don't know if the steps are going to work for me. I know they work for you.

I know they work for your sponsor. I see them working for other people, but I don't know if the 12 steps will work for me. He pointed out the fact that I had not yet taken the 12 steps.

So, I could not have an opinion on experience I had not had yet. So, therefore, the only thing I had to do was put into action and do the 12 steps and put them into my lifestyle. You know, he pointed out that, you know, that I needed a spiritual awakening in order to get well.

That's what it says in we agnostics. Okay. the very, you know, after 50 pages of being convinced that I can't drink normally, when I put alcohol in my body, I don't act like everybody else and I can't not put alcohol in my body because of a mental obsession.

50 pages to get me convinced of two things. It's like I wonder if I was thickheaded, you know. So, uh, you know, but once I got convinced of those two things, it then says in we agnostics that the only thing that's going to solve, you know, solve it, you know, is a spiritual awakening.

He pointed out to me that that spiritual awakening is guaranteed to me as a result of the 12 steps. All I had to do was take them. You know, he also pointed out to me that, you know, after I get to the 12th step, it's not a finish line, it's a beginning.

Because after I have a spiritual awakening, I then get to carry that message to others, you know. So, I would get involved in helping people. And for a guy like me who'd been who felt useless in his entire life, the idea of being useful sounded like a pretty good deal to me, you know.

So, I looked forward to someday being, you know, being able to help somebody, you know. So um you know so we got down to work and we started you know we started working those 12 steps you know and the um you know the the the changes that started to happen in my life the personality change that started to happen you know again it was apparent to other people before it was apparent to me you know I'm to this day I'm still my own worst critic you know I want to be perfect but being human forever gets in the way of that you know so um you know so but um you know I did them to the best of my ability I continue to do them to the best of my ability today you know and uh you know when I left that man because I did I would be coming home to move back down to New York you know back to New York rather you know I left him I I can say that I worked all 12 steps of alcoholics anonymous so when I got back to New York you know what I tried to do was I tried to carry that message that was given to me by those people in Greensboro you know there's a message of depth and weight in in the big book there's recovery in these rooms you can get well you know and I tried to carry a big book message when I got back to New York and I was met with a ton of resistance you know, those same people who told me I wasn't sober enough to do a fourth and fifth step. The same, you know, now what I started to get is what do you know?

You're only sober a year. You know, you're not as sober as we are. So, all they what they started doing was they started, you know, not, you know, not knocking me down a peg.

They, you know, trying to take away, you know, some of the stuff that, you know, some of the stuff that I've gotten. And because there's still that part of me, you know, that wants to be liked, you know, what happened was I started to give in and I started to not share as much and I started to, you know, slowly, you know, become a, you know, fader inner. I I would rather be part of the crowd than be, you know, than stand out, you know.

So my recovery consisted of blending in, you know, and, you know, ra, you know, rather than, you know, rather than, you know, standing out as a representative of, you know, God's handiwork. You know, I forgot about that part in the third step prayer where I was going to bear witness to those I would help of his power, his love, and his way of life. Instead, all I wanted to do is just blend in and be part of the scenery.

You know, you fast forward, you fast forward in my, you know, my recovery. You know, in 2002, I met my uh, you know, now wife. You know, I started dating her and, you know, then that that got serious and then we got married and, you know, then we bought a house.

And the cool thing about buying that house is the house I have my name on the mortgage today is the very same house I almost got thrown out of because of my drinking, you know. So that house that I almost got thrown out of, I now reside in. Okay?

You know, and the um and the coolest thing about that is my 8-year-old son now sleeps in my old bedroom. So when I tuck him in at night, I can still close my eyes and I can still pinpoint exactly where my bed used to be. I can still point pinpoint exactly where my refrigerator used to be.

And I can look in his, you know, at night he has me check his closet to see if the boogeyman's in there. And when I open up his closet to see there's nothing in there. In the back of my head, all I really see is the stacks of empty 12-packs that used to be stacked in there because in New York we got a 5-cent refund and I'm cheap as hell.

So, I was not going to pay 5 cents for the bottle and then not get my 5 cents back, you know? So, when you get your refund money back, you actually feel like you're getting over on the guy because like, oh, look, I get, you know, you get to apply your refund money to the, you know, to your purchase price. So, it's like, it's like, you know, I always thought I was saving money.

So, but the coolest thing about that, like I said, I get to if I can't, you know, I get to see what I used to be living a different life today because like I said, all this is going on while I'm tucking my son into bed, you know. So um you know so I mean what happened you know what happened to me was you know I started to want to take credit for all those good things that were happening from in my life. I want to take credit for being a great husband.

You know I want to take credit for changing jobs for a better career. I want to take credit for being a good employee. I want to take credit for you know this that and the other thing.

And when you start taking credit like that it doesn't leave an awful lot of room you know for God you know. So what happened was I started to ease God out of the equation and I started playing God again. And what happened was, you know, that spiritual malady starts to come back and you start to just not drink and just go to meetings and I turn, you know, so I started turning into the that the type of person that I really couldn't stand, you know, and the uh you know, and you know what happened to me was after a couple years of that, you know, my sponsor today calls it the spiritual plaque built up.

You know, I had been maintaining to the best of my ability, but you know, you I can maintain brushing my teeth every day, but I'll be damned if every time I don't go to the dentist, he's scraping off a whole bunch of plaque that built up, you know, cuz there's stuff that happens that's beyond my control. So, my maintenance of my spiritual growth, okay, was not to the extent of where it needed to be. So, a whole bunch of spiritual plaque had built up in my life.

And the only thing I knew that would take care of that was to go through the work again, you know, to go through the steps. So, I went out and I bought a brand new big book. I brought a fourth edition big book because I used to walk around with my third edition.

Like I said, like it was a badge of honor. You know, people be like, "Hey, we're going to read in the doctor's opinion on page XX." Um, wait a minute, that's a different page for me because I don't have a forward to the fourth edition. So, hold on.

Let me figure out where you guys are, you know? So, you know, like I said, I used to try and show off. And meanwhile, it's probably look like the world's biggest jackass because it's just like, look at him.

He's got to be different, you know. So, I went and bought a brand new fourth edition big book and I started going through it because I knew I knew what to look for. I knew that there was action that I had to take that I hadn't been taking.

I knew that there were prayers that needed to be said that I hadn't been saying. I knew that there were promises that I had been that hadn't been coming true in my life because, you know, one of the things that Joe taught me was the most important word in the big book is the word if. Okay?

There's promises in the book that have the word if. If you're doing this, then this will happen. So, a lot of the promises are contingent upon what I'm doing.

I hadn't been doing the stuff. So, I wasn't getting those promises. So, the promises in the book in order for me to get them, I had to be doing, you know, I had to be doing the stuff that it's contingent upon happening and that I wasn't doing.

So, I had to do that stuff. You know, I had a new spiritual awakening as a result of, you know, going through the work again. Okay.

And my life did change dramatically. You know, the uh that was in 2010. Okay?

You fast forward one year in 2011, my son was born. you know, the I know to I know today that that was the first like sign from my higher power that I you know that I was you know that I was a grown-up. Okay, I was I was 15 years sober when he was born and I knew that it was at that point that God could trust me with another human being.

You know, he could trust me one of his kids that I can raise, you know, that I could take care of and that I could be responsible for because when I came in here I couldn't even take care of myself, you know. I was I was I was lucky, you know, I was lucky if I had showered that day, you know, when I first came in here, you know. So, you know, now I could now not not only was I taking care of myself, but I was, you know, part of it, you know, part of a marriage, but now I could also raise another human being.

You know, the um that you know, every night when I tuck him in, like I said, you know, it's like in spite of all that picture and everything where it is, you know, whenever I tuck my son in at night, you know, I do ask him every night, I'm like, you know, dad loves you, right? And every night, you know, it just it melts my heart every night he says yes. you know, because like I said, you know, I was I was raised, you know, with a father who, you know, I'll be, you know, I'll be 44, you know, in June.

And to this day, my I I tell you beyond a shadow of a doubt, give me a stack of bottles. My dad has never told me he loves me, you know, not that that has anything to do with my alcoholism or anything, but I want my kid to know that he's loved. You know, I want my son to grow up in a household where, you know, because like I said, I went to Catholic school and I was an alter boy.

And when we said our father, I used to get pictures of disgust, disdain, you know, not even disgust but disdain. And you know, because I could not stand, you know, the the picture of our father, but today the our father is much different for me, you know, and I know for my son, it's probably much different for him because he sees a dad who loves him, you know. I um you know, every it looks like this summer we might be screwed, but you know, who knows?

But uh one of the things I do with my son every summer I take him on a on a trip. You know, my son is 8 years old and I've taken him to eight baseball stadiums in his lifetime. That's, you know, I love baseball.

I'm raising him and, you know, loving baseball and, you know, so we take trips every summer. So, I go on a vacation just, you know, my my uh my buddy my buddy Tom, you know, um myself and my son, you know, we go on a little dude cation, you know, just the three of us, you know, just to go hang out, go see baseball, and you know, and my son, you know, so my son will have fond memories of, you know, just just hanging out with him and his old man, you know. Um, you fast forward to 2015.

My daughter was born. You know, she's a uh she's a handful and a half. You know, she's 4 years old.

I'm already saving her a seat. You know, you know, defiance is definitely her outstanding characteristic. You know, I know today she has a physical allergy to the word no.

You know, whenever she hears it, she breaks out in a temper tantrum. You know, so she's, you know, she's definitely, you know, one of us, you know, the uh, you know, I just need I just need her to discover alcohol so that way she can officially be an alcoholic, you know. But um you know I also mentioned this you know it came out during the last chat and I felt bad about it until I talked to some people and some people like no if it's coming out you should definitely bring it up.

You know after my daughter was born one other thing that happened to me you know it was like a couple weeks after my daughter was born all of a sudden I found myself like forever tired and like I would take a nap and I would wake up from a nap and I was even more tired than I was before. And I wanted nothing to do with my wife. I wanted nothing to do with my brand new daughter.

I wanted I couldn't stand when the phone would ring. I didn't wouldn't want to answer because I didn't want to talk to anybody. I had a commitment in my home group.

I would go to my home group to chair the meeting and they you know and I they would take one look at me. I was like, "Dude, you should go see a doctor. You don't look so good." You know, cuz I I just looked run down.

I looked tired. I looked beat up. But, you know, and you know, so I mean I went to the emergency room one night and you know, you know, just cuz I was like I can't live like this anymore.

It's been 10 days and I've lost 10 I've lost 10 pounds already and and just there doesn't seem to be any sunrise on the, you know, on the horizon, you know. So, I went to the emergency room and, you know, they they took a blood test on me and they, you know, they they ran this test, they ran that test and everything came back negative, you know. So, the these are medical professionals who were just like, "Look, we we have no idea what's going on with you.

Um, the only thing that we have is here. we're going to give you an antibiotic for an exotic bug bite. You know, maybe, you know, maybe you caught some, you know, maybe you caught something, you know, and this will take care of it because we have no other idea.

So, I'm pretty sure I was protected against malaria, you know, should I, you know, you know, and and against other exotic stuff. But, you know, I got a phone call the following day from a family friend who's a nurse practitioner because behind my back, my wife called my mom and my mom called the family friend and the family friend called me and she just wanted to talk with me. She's like, "Matt, everybody's concerned about you." You know, so you fast forward, you know, we had a conversation.

I told her all my, you know, symptoms that I can see. And when we was done, she's like, "Uh, Matt," she goes, "You're not even breathing during the whole conversation." She goes, "You take a shallow breath in." She goes, "Then you sigh out." She goes, "I've listened to everything you've said." She goes, "Matt, in my professional opinion," she goes, "I believe." She goes, "You're showing all the signs of depression, you know." And my my first instinct was, "I'm a step guy. I can't possibly suffer from depression, you know." And I I and I was very close-minded to what she had to say.

And then, you know, but then she had a sales pitch, you know, that that it was definitely, you know, definitely a sales pitch that worked for me. She was, "Man, I'm not here to tell you what to do." She said, "I'm not here to treat you. I'm just here to guide you if you want, you know, if you want to have an open mind." And what I had to do is I had to open have an open mind because everything I knew hadn't worked, you know, and you know, so she was just offering me maybe a different way out.

And I know today that I was suffering from depression because when she did put me on medication I you know within a short period of time I did react the way one would norm the one normally would react you know when they were suffering from that and they were given the the correct treatment you know so what I know today is I suffer from another illness other than alcoholism that needs its own separate treatment you know so if you are one of those people that may be suffering from it don't you know you know the you may have a disease okay other than alcoholism that may need treatment you know, but um my life today, what it's like, like I said, my son knows that I love him, even though he's seen me on page 52 in the book. You know, today was another rainy day on Long Island and, you know, with day 60 of a quarantine. Thank you.

Thank you, Governor New York, for giving us an exact day count. You know, I remember being, you know, newly sober, counting days. Now, the governor's counting days for quarantine.

So, you know, today was day 60 according to him. So, you know, so, you know, so it was another rainy day. the the four walls seem a whole hell of a lot smaller when you got four people between them on a rainy day with no place to go when you got two two kids who want to be entertained, you know, and the uh you know, so it was not not a good day, you know.

Good news is everybody's, you know, still breathing. Nobody got killed, you know. And the uh my 11step, you know, nightly review is definitely going to have a couple things that need to be fixed up tomorrow, you know, but uh because I don't do this thing perfectly, you know, but um you know, this is only my third time speaking, you know, in the past year because I did get a resentment against my home group and I pulled away from the fellowship of Alcoholics Anonymous and I pulled away from my sponsor and so I was unplugged from all all three sides of the triangle because I was not unified with the fellowship.

I was outside the herd. I was, you know, I was not working the steps. So I was not I was not recovering so good.

And when you got no message to bring, you're not working with many people. So I was not doing much service. So when it comes to all three sides of the triangle, mine was collapsing.

And you know, I still have an ego that rebuilds itself. So my ego was telling me, well, you'll be 24 years sober. You're going to be fine.

You know, I know today that back in January was probably, God willing, will be the closest I ever come to taking a drink. You know, the only thing that kept me sober was get, you know, was that, you know, was I know that I still have no defense against the higher power. It says in the book that I may be in in the grips of a progressive illness.

It says nothing in the big book about it. Only progressing while I'm drinking. So, I know my alcoholism has gotten worse over the past 24 years, you know.

So, I hope to God I never find out, you know, how, you know, how close I was to a drink, you know, because I do believe that, you know, that it was the case, you know. But um you know what it's like you know what I'm like now is I did reconnect with my sponsor. You know he gave me a whole bunch of spiritual exercises amongst them going through the steps again.

Like I said I just finished another fourth step today. I do have a fifth step appointment for Tuesday. You know I look forward to getting through that.

You know I look forward to you know more will be revealed. So I'll probably find out you know you know some of my old character defects are back and you know who knows I'm a new person today. So maybe some new ones appeared.

You know some ones that I haven't you know gotten names for yet. you know, the um you know, and the um I just look forward to, you know, having another spiritual awakening as a result of going through these steps again. You know, and the uh you know, when you show back up on the firing lines, you know, it doesn't take long for God to put you to use, you know, I I wound up in a meeting one Saturday morning that was just I again, you intuitively know how to handle situations which used to baffle you.

God, what meeting should I go for? I paused. I asked for the right thought or action.

I I was, you know, I was instructed in, you know, in a calm, still voice to go to this, you know, Saturday morning meeting. And when I wound up in it, okay, it was before I found serendipity. So don't think I'm cheating on you guys, okay?

So, but it was it was it was a as Bill sees it meeting. And when it came time for my turn to share again, I care more about saving lives today than I care about being liked. So I carried that big book message that I was, you know, that I was rediscovering because my sponsor had me reading through the book again because, you know, it had been far too long since I cracked the cover, you know.

So he had me re and so I shared a big book message you know one of depth and weight and out of that came a sponsy okay so you know thanks to this whole zoom platform you know I'm now sponsoring a guy in can you know who lives in Canada okay and I got friends in you know so he's by Toronto and again you know when they ask who I got friends in Alberta Canada today I got friends in you know in uh in Seattle Washington so thanks to Zoom I now have friends in all four time zones you know of the of the uh you know north American continent you know so um My life today, I have been rocketed into that fourth dimension of existence. You know, I do have an, you know, I do have a rel a new found relationship with that higher power. I found out my life today, like I said, I, you know, with two kids, I got a whole hell of a lot more that I got to give over to God.

You know, one of the spiritual exercises that my sponsor had me do, you know, that I've been working with, it says in the right after taking a third step prayer in the big book, it says the wording of course was quite optional. You know, so my sponsor has me write my own third step prayer, one that I get to say on a daily basis. So the good news is it's not filled with thous and you know you know thighs like Bill puts in there to make them look fancy you know it's in language that my higher you know they came from my heart they directly to the ears of my higher power so I can communicate today with my higher power my own language and I can meet you know he can meet me where I am you know because God does not make too hard a terms to those who seek him you know is another promise in you know in the book so the more I seek him the more I'll find him the more I'll find him the more you know the more will be revealed you know the um You know, like I said, I'm living in a fourth dimension of existence today.

It's not always perfect. I don't do this thing perfect. My feet are made of clay.

Like I said, today was a not so good day. I do have, you know, some amends I got to make tomorrow cuz I already tuck my daughter to bed. And when I put my daughter to bed, you know, like I told you how I put my son to bed.

But when I put my daughter to bed, every night she asked me give her a kiss, you know. So I you give me we call them mooch. So I say give dad a mooch, you know.

So she gives me a kiss and I say, you know, and she goes and a big hug. So when we give a hug, it can't just be a regular hug where we put our arms around each other. We got to put our arms around each other and we got to go because that's a big hug without the it's just a regular hug.

And we don't we don't we don't give regular hugs, we give big hugs, you know. So some so you know what my kids are being raised in is a you know as a family, you know, is they're being raised in the treated disease of alcoholism. you know, they're they're finding, you know, they're finding out that hopefully someday when they learn the our father, you know, they won't have that disdain in their head of, you know, their, you know, of they're seeing their father.

They'll have they'll have a better understanding of what a father is, you know, because the the only, you know, example I have today is, you know, how can I be a loving how can I be an example of a loving, caring God to my kids? And that's what I that's what I try and live up to every day, you know. And the uh I end a lot of my talks with this.

And you know, the um you know, just because to me, it's one of the coolest things, you know. I got this I got this um coaster in my big book. Okay.

On one side, and I'll hold it up to the camera. It's got ice cream on it. On the other side, it's got beer in it.

On it. Okay. My 5-year-old son, when he was 5 years old, we were sitting at a restaurant one day, and he slides it across the table to me, and he goes, "Dad," he goes, "Do you like ice cream?" He turns it over and he goes, "Oh, do you like beer?" And I said, 'Well, buddy, we're we're out on dudes time right now.

Which meant it was just me and him. Okay. So, we're out on dudes time right now.

I says, "And we're having ice cream, so you know, dad loves ice cream." And I turned it over and I says, "And dad doesn't drink." I said, "So, dad doesn't like beer." And so, my 5-year-old son with all the love in his voice and all the love in his eyes, you know, looked at me and he goes, "Dad," he goes, "you do drink." He goes, "You drink a lot of coffee." When I was five years old, living with an alcoholic, if you asked me what my dad drank all the time, coffee would have been the furthest thing from my mind. My five-year-old son thinks I drink too much coffee. And if that's what my kid thinks I drink too much of, okay, I'll take that any day of the week because, like I said before, God is not good.

God is great. Okay, so I I'm convinced today of the three-part ideas that I'm alcoholic. I cannot manage my own life.

that probably no human power, including myself, can relieve my me of my alcoholism and that God could and would if he were sought. So, it's up to my job to do the seeking and it's up to God's job to do the miracles. And so far, so good because he's taken a helpless, helpless alcoholic who walked in the rooms of AA and has turned him into a useful, caring, loving human being.

And with that, I'll close. Thanks for having me. >> Thank you for listening to Sober Sunrise.

If you enjoyed today's episode, please give it a thumbs up as it will help share the message. Until next time, have a great day.