I Didn’t Know AA Had a Skybox – AA Speaker – Charlie P.
AA speaker Charlie P. shares his story of 39 years sober, including untreated alcoholism in recovery and how deep Big Book work transformed his spiritual program and relationships.
Charlie P., sober since March 1985, is an AA speaker from Austin, Texas who spent much of his early sobriety unknowingly working a program based on the wrong problem. In this AA speaker meeting, he walks through how he eventually discovered that alcohol wasn’t his real problem—selfishness was—and how returning to intensive Big Book study and step work in his late recovery fundamentally changed everything he thought he understood about the program.
Charlie P., an AA speaker with 39 years of sobriety, describes decades of untreated alcoholism within the rooms of AA, despite attending meetings and working the steps. He explains how a misunderstanding of the book’s focus on page 60 (selfishness and self-centeredness as the root problem) led him to work a surface-level program of abstinence rather than spiritual transformation. Through intensive Big Book study with his sponsor Mark H., deep step work emphasizing character defects and amends, and a life-threatening plane crash that shattered his false confidence, Charlie discovered the real solution available in recovery.
Episode Summary
Charlie P. opens with his characteristic humor and a talking dog joke that sets up the perfect frame for his message: in AA, it doesn’t matter how good the story is if it’s not coming from your own experience. What follows is one of recovery’s most honest portraits of a man who spent decades physically sober but spiritually stuck—and how the work changed everything.
Charlie starts with his background in Dallas, growing up in a stable family with high expectations he couldn’t meet. He began drinking at 16, and by 17 or 18, he’d crossed that invisible line into alcoholism. By his own account, he never once turned down an opportunity to get loaded under any circumstances. The stories are vivid: blackout DWIs, hitting his mother’s car into a police car while driving stolen, pawning his father’s possessions repeatedly despite genuine promises to stop. He describes the pawn shop cycle with brutal honesty—making plans that looked good until they stopped working, caught in a loop he couldn’t escape despite having lost the power of choice.
When Charlie came into AA in 1985 at age 28, he worked the steps, attended Big Book meetings, even studied with Joe and Charlie. But here’s where his message becomes crucial: he worked a program thinking the problem was alcohol. For decades, this meant he could say “I didn’t drink today” while screaming at his wife, avoiding his kids, living in dishonesty and self-pity, and creating wreckage everywhere he went. He was what the Big Book describes as someone living on self-will—making promises he couldn’t keep, manipulating people, falling into the victim mentality that alcohol had temporarily soothed.
Around 17 years sober, Charlie hit what he calls his “flat period”—meeting-based sobriety, going through the motions, not feeling it. Then came a moment that could have killed him: a chartered plane lost engine power over Long Island and crash-landed in water. Everyone survived except his dog. That near-death experience cracked something open, but it took a sponsor like Mark H. to show him what he’d been missing all along.
The turning point was understanding page 60 of the Big Book, which Charlie had read dozens of times without seeing it. The book states clearly that “any life run on self-will can hardly be a success.” Charlie had been living on self-will his entire sobriety. He’d been using meetings and abstinence to manage the symptoms while the disease—his obsession with himself—raged on. Mark H. would ask him directly: “What does ‘above everything’ mean to you?” Above everything, he had to get rid of selfishness, or it would kill him.
From there, Charlie describes a complete recalibration of his program. Instead of inventory as confession, it became a study of how selfishness and self-centeredness showed up in his life. Instead of amends as apology, they became a rigorous process of understanding his role in harm and making concrete restitution. He tells a powerful story about sponsoring a man who’d held a 42-year resentment against his father for insensitively announcing his mother’s suicide. Through the “sick man prayer” between the third and fourth columns of a proper fourth step, that resentment dissolved in an afternoon—not because the father’s actions were excused, but because the man could finally see his father as spiritually sick, doing the best he could, rather than as an intentional wound.
The amends process shifted too. Instead of a simple list, Charlie and his sponsor created 3×5 cards with the person’s name, the nature of the harm, and two key questions: “How can I make this right?” and crucially, “Have I harmed you in any other way?” Because as Charlie puts it, when you’re as self-centered as he was, you have almost no conception of your effect on people around you. His wife Katie’s story of an expanding amends list illustrates this beautifully—and with humor that keeps the message grounded.
Most importantly, Charlie describes what happened when he actually worked steps 10 and 11 as written—continuing to watch for selfishness, dishonesty, resentment, and fear; calling someone; asking God to remove it; making amends for it; turning his attention to helping someone else. This wasn’t theory; this was a daily practice that transformed his sobriety from dry to alive.
Charlie is clear that he’s not perfect. He tells a story of yelling at a Sprint store employee the day after giving a three-year chip to a sponsee, then catching himself and using it as a teaching moment. But this is precisely his point: the 10th step works because it keeps him honest and moving forward rather than accumulating resentments and character defects.
He emphasizes the power of sponsorship—not asking for a sponsor but being willing to approach someone and tell them, directly, that they need a sponsor. He talks about the difference between unity (fellowship), service (doing work), and recovery (working the steps), and how all three are necessary for a solid foundation. He mentions his wife Katie, who came into AA in 1984 and has become a powerhouse sponsor and teacher herself, offering workshops on how to sponsor women through the steps.
At 39 years sober, Charlie describes his sobriety as better than it’s ever been. He has a new sponsor (his beloved sponsor Mark H. passed away in February). He and Katie are on fire with the program, sponsoring about 40 people between them, and running the Primary Purpose Group in Austin, which meets Tuesday nights to study the Big Book line by line with about 175 people.
His final message is about the promise on page 100: “When we look back, we realize that the things which came to us when we put ourselves in God’s hands were better than anything we could have planned.” Charlie drives this home by contrasting his life with that of an old running partner now doing 35 years in prison. Alcoholics Anonymous didn’t just keep him from drinking; it gave him a life—children, business, friendships, a marriage built on real love and honesty.
Notable Quotes
Around AA, it doesn’t really matter how good the story is if it’s not coming out of my own experience.
I have a physical allergy to alcohol that makes me react funny when I take a drink, and then I have a mental obsession that makes me uncomfortable sober until I drink again. I couldn’t stop drinking—I couldn’t stop starting.
What makes me alcoholic is not that I couldn’t stop drinking. My problem was I couldn’t stop starting.
When I was promising my dad I would never do it again, I might as well have been promising him I was going to flap my arms and fly around this room, because I did not have the power to do it.
If the problem was alcohol, you don’t even belong here. The problem with alcoholism is not alcohol—alcohol was my solution.
All of my memories of my childhood are about me. I don’t have any memories of the struggles my parents went through. It’s me, me, me, me, me.
Selfishness and self-centeredness—most newcomers think we mean stingy and conceited. No, I just think about me too much.
I was dying of untreated alcoholism well into this deal, even though I was sitting in AA meetings for years.
Above everything, I got to get rid of this selfishness, or it’ll kill me.
When you’re properly armed with the facts about yourself and you have something to carry, that’s the power of this work.
I didn’t know AA had a skybox—I’ve been sitting in the cheap seats for 20 years thinking I’d experienced everything AA had to offer.
Steps 8 & 9 – Making Amends
Big Book Study
Sponsorship
Self-Pity & Ego
Topics Covered in This Transcript
- Step 4 – Resentments & Inventory
- Steps 8 & 9 – Making Amends
- Big Book Study
- Sponsorship
- Self-Pity & Ego
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Full AA Speaker Transcript
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Welcome to Sober Sunrise, a podcast bringing you AA speaker meetings with stories of experience, strength, and hope from around the world. We bring you several new speakers weekly, so be sure to subscribe. If you'd like to help us remain self-supporting, please visit our website at sober-rise.com.
Whether you join us in the morning or at night, there's nothing better than a sober sunrise. We hope that you enjoy today's speaker. The way I understand it, Charlie P um just got married recently to his lovely wife Katie and and uh but uh he told me and I want to hear the truth about this.
They've dated for 25 years. So with that, come on up, Charlie. >> >> Y'all nervous?
Let me make sure I get this. Is that all right, Terry? I'm Charlie Parker.
I'm a grateful recovered alcoholic. I'm a member of the primary purpose group in Austin, Texas. We meet on Tuesday nights to study the big book line by line, week by week.
It uh usually have about 175 people on a Tuesday night studying the big book. If you're ever in Austin on a Tuesday night, we'd love to we'd love to have you. I uh um my sobriety date is March 22nd of 1985.
And for that, I am truly grateful. I uh uh I have a sponsor. I have a new sponsor.
My sponsor passed away in February. Uh um Mark Houston was my sponsor up until this past February. And um I have a new sponsor now and his he has Larry Jay from Dallas and his sponsors Tom I and uh I'm real proud about that all those associations.
I um I uh I'm real happy to be here tonight. I've got Katie with me. I um I want to thank the committee for having me here.
It's a real honor to be involved in Alcoholics Anonymous at any level, whether it's making the coffee or chairing the meeting or or getting to talk at a conference. I mean, it's just a real honor to be uh part of a fellowship that I love so much. tell you um I want to thank the host, you know, uh Chris for all the work that he's done and and Price picked us up at the airport today and took us out for a really nice lunch.
And uh and you know, if you've been involved in a in a conference like this, if you ever been involved in putting one of these things together, you know that there's just a whole lot that goes into putting one of these things on. There's a lot of people that do a lot of work to get one of these things to come together. And if it's if it's like the AA where I come from, there's also a whole lot of people that don't do a darn thing.
Uh but but they have a lot of ideas about how it could have been done just a little bit better, you know? I mean, that's the fellowship I crave, you know. But I'm real glad to be here tonight.
I got a um I'm We are here from Texas, Austin, Texas. Katie and I are here from Texas. There's people here from all over.
I uh uh the way I was raised, you my father told me it was impolite to ask anybody where they're from because he said if they're from Texas, they'll tell you and if they're not, you you shouldn't embarrass them. But uh but uh so but I got to I got to straighten up a little bit about what he was saying about Katie. Katie and I do have my lovely wife Katie is here with us and uh um and uh a darn good AA on in her own right.
And I hope to talk about some of that a little later. But we have known each other. We were litter mates coming in in uh in ' 85.
She came in ' 84 and I came in in 85. Well, I came in in ' 84, too, but I've been sober since ' 85. But we sobered up together.
She was 26, I was 28 at the time. And um she was married the first 20 years that I knew her. And we were like brother and sister.
It was really the first really close female friendship I'd ever had. And uh um uh 7 years ago, her husband passed away unfortunately from a brain tumor. And um and then uh she caught me in a weak moment one day.
And uh and uh we we started we started dating and uh um and it's it's just been it's been great. It's a it's a wonderful thing. And I hope you get a chance to visit with Katie during the course of the weekend.
I mean, before I go any further, I should look and see what time it is. Um, before I go any further, what a place this is. My god.
I mean, if you're listening to this on the CD, and I want to thank Terry for being here recording this. You got to get to this thing. I mean, this is the last thing we did was two weeks ago at a Franciscan monastery in upstate New York.
And it was a little more Spartan than the accommodations here. I mean I mean we checked into our room there and I and I remember thinking this is a lot like being in jail, you know. I mean that the the our cell I started to say our room was uh was pretty plain at that place, but it was it was fun being there.
But I mean this is unbelievable. I mean and you know if you we we're lucky enough to get around and go a few conferences and they're not all like this one. I mean this is this it's just starting tonight but I'm really looking forward especially once I get my talk over.
I um I can just kind of chill for the rest of the weekend. And um but you know, my purpose here tonight is to talk about what I was like, what happened, and what I'm like now. And you know, it always but in a it always reminds me of this uh story about this.
He told a joke I'm going to tell one. You may have heard this before, but I like it and I like the way I tell it, so I'm going to I'm going to go ahead. There's this guy that's driving along one day and he sees a sign at this farmhouse and it says talking dog for sale.
And uh he stops the car and he goes up to this farmer and he goes, "You got a talking dog for sale?" And the guy goes, "Yeah, he's around back." And he goes around back and there's this hound dog laying there and he says, "So you can talk?" And the dog says, "Well, I certainly can." Uh and uh he says, "How did that happen?" He goes, "Well, when I was young, when I was a pup, I started picking up the language a little bit here and there. And as I got older, I developed the nuances of the language and voice inflection, that sort of thing. And uh it's really been it's led an amazing life for me.
I worked for the Drug Enforcement Administration for 22 years. And I was able to infiltrate some scenes that no human agent could have ever gotten into. And and be beyond that, I've eaten in some of the finest restaurants in the world and stayed in some of the finest hotels.
But even more interesting that some of my pups have become international diplomats and uh have traveled all over the world. It's it's all in all it's just been an amazing life for me. And uh the guy says, "Well, it's just been fascinating talking to you." And he goes back up to the farmer and he says, "How much do you want for a dog like that?" And the guy goes, "I don't know, 20 bucks." And he goes, "Why would you sell a fabulous dog like that for 20 bucks?" And the guy goes, "None of that crap he told you is true." Yeah.
>> >> So, around aa, it doesn't really matter how good the story is if it's if it's not coming out of my own experience. I uh I grew up in Dallas, Texas. Uh I was born in 56 at the towards the tail end of the baby boom, but that it was in the baby boom.
There were 61 children on the block that I grew up on and and uh I come from a pretty normal family. I mean, I know that normal is a setting on a washing machine, but it's pretty normal. I've heard enough fifth steps over the years to know that a lot of people had it a hell of a lot worse than I ever had it growing up.
And I mean, it was just a pretty regular family. There wasn't anybody drinking. There wasn't anybody beating each other up.
There was, you know, it was just um you know, a pretty decent little family. But I I did have my mother was a school teacher for 42 years, first grade school teacher. So I was pretty well prepared for the first grade.
I um in fact I kind of kicked ass in the first grade, you know. Um but and then my sister was kind of perfect. Um my sister was National Honor Society, first chair, floutist, uh drum majorette, you know, you name it.
And uh and then I'm this kind of thuggish little brother and and uh um but I I grew up Anybody else grew up under the burden of potential? Um you know, I mean, I grew up hearing about my potential and why can't you live up to your potential and why can't you be more like Charles Malier across the street? And and I remember thinking, well, it's flattering that you'd say that, Mom, but I mean, I'm really not holding back that much, you know?
It's like you you're kind of getting my best shot here, you know, and but I didn't start drinking till I was 16. I started drinking when I was 16 years old. And you know, it's funny.
I used to think the way I grew up, I grew up in a Baptist church in Dallas. And I I used to think that uh 16 was kind of young to get started drinking. And nowadays it's not even young to stop, you know.
I mean, it's, you know, I mean, there's people picking up desire chips at nine or something. I, you know, I mean, but I don't mean to bust anybody. Much love for the young alcoholics.
I mean, you know, I uh cuz I mean, I started drinking at 16 and I probably didn't really need this program till I was like 17, you know. I mean, I had I had kind of held it together there for a while, but I mean, I was I I ran at it pretty hard. And uh you know, our big book, this is a big book of Alcoholics Anonymous that a friend of mine bought for me.
It's nothing no outside literature. It's just a large print version of the big book, Alcoholics Anonymous. And I love this book.
It it didn't it doesn't wait long to start making us promises. right there on the cover page. It says how many thousands of men and women have recovered from alcoholism.
And I like to in that book it says in the doctor's opinion it says uh men and women drink essentially because they like the effect produced by alcohol. Everybody with me on that one? You know I mean it is okay to like the effect produced by alcohol.
I uh I think it's a little understated. You know the doctor wasn't one of us. I uh I mean cuz uh I mean I like banana pudding, you know, but but I love the effect produced by alcohol.
I didn't just burn my world to the ground multiple times over something. I kind of dig a little bit, you know. I mean, kind of had a little thing for alcohol, but but you know, by by the time I was 17 or 18, I I'd crossed a line in my drinking.
You know, I crossed some sort of invisible line. I don't know when it happened exactly. I think that's why they call it an invisible line.
But somewhere along the line, I started what makes me alcoholic. And it's funny. I mean, how many people in AA will uh there's a lot of people in AA that that would say they're alcoholic that don't really know what it means to be alcoholic.
You know, I mean, I said I was and I know that because I was one of them for a good while. I spent a good deal of time sitting in AA meetings raising my hand and saying, "My name's Charlie. I'm alcoholic.
And I I didn't have any idea what it meant. I thought I was alcoholic because I'd had DWIs and I'd lost jobs and I'd crashed cars and I'd been to jail and that sort of thing. But but what makes me alcoholic is two things.
I got a physical allergy to alcohol that makes me react funny when I take a drink. And then u I like to say that I only have two problems with drinking. One happens to me when I drink it or two problems with alcohol.
One happens to me when I drink it. The other one happens to me when I don't drink it. You know, it's I got the what happens when I drink it is this uh phenomenon of craving that it kicks in and when I take a drink alcohol, I don't have any control over how much I'm going to drink or when I'm going to stop or how long it's going to last.
But the the second part of that, you know, that I always say if if that was my biggest problem, my answer would be just don't drink, you know. But I I my problem wasn't that I couldn't stop drinking. I couldn't stop starting.
Every time I would stop drinking, I would always start again. And that's where the second part comes in. The book calls it and the book does a beautiful job of describing all this stuff in the first 43 pages where I've also got this mental obsession.
I get so uncomfortable sober that after a period of time I am going to drink again. Um, you know, they used a lot of words when I came in that I wasn't used to using, you know. I mean, did anybody else experience that in the book?
I mean, did you did you ever sit around the bar and talk about phenomenon of craving? And, you know, I don't think I ever said phenomenon at all. You know, I mean, I had to look it up in the dictionary to find out.
It means something that happens, but we don't really know why it happens. It's just kind of a weird thing that happens. But but you know then you hear some of these terms in AA that don't have anything to do with alcoholics anonymous you know but they work their way into the fellowship and and uh you know our book talks about the ex problem drinker who it's on page 18 it says the ex-prom drinker who's found our solution who's properly armed with the facts about himself can generally win the confidence of a new man in a matter of hours and says until such a identification ation.
This is the key part. It says until such an identification is reached, little or nothing can be accomplished. So little or nothing can be accomplished until we establish that identification.
It makes it sound like that identification is is uh pretty important, but I mean we're talking about identification, you know, and I mean, and they one of the terms that they used to use in treatment center was uh did anybody ever use the term uh hear the term drug of choice in the treatment center? Anybody anybody hear that? Did Did anybody talk like that on the street?
I mean, seriously. I mean, can you imagine being sitting at somebody's house, you know, and somebody goes, "Look what I have." And I'm going to go, "Well, I'm sure that's nice for you." Um, different strokes and all, but, uh, doesn't happen to be my particular drug of choice, you know. I, uh, I'm just going to take, you boys go ahead.
I'm going to take a seat over here and wait for my drug of choice to appear. Um but I mean but I but having said that I have deep experience with outside issues uh you know and but I'm I'm speaking at an AA conference. I'm speaking as an alcoholic and it's an AA meeting and I have deep respect for AA singleness of purpose and it comes with that identification in that um AA is about alcoholics working with alcoholics and uh you know that identific that's where it says that identification until such an identification takes place little or nothing can be accomplished and you know we all you remember the first time you you talked to somebody that had quit drinking that drank like you did how you knew something special was going on I mean cuz If you drink like I do, you're used to people wanting to talk to you about your drinking.
I mean that, you know, that's usually right after a run. You know, they're like, "Why did you do it?" And, you know, and I gave them the only answer that we had. It's the same answer you guys had.
You know, it's what? Why'd you put go on that run again? I don't know.
I don't know. I don't know. You know what?
And it doesn't help them a lot. If you even if you study the first 43 pages, it doesn't make your family feel much better when you go, "Well, mom, you see, I have a uh a mental obsession. I have driven by a spiritual malady that triggers a phenomenon of craving." And you know, but that identification is key.
I mean, and and you know, it's funny because really out of all the 12step programs, the only difference in any of them, and there's a squillion of them. I mean, I even heard about a lip balm addicts anonymous the other day, in case anybody's ever had that heartbreaking malady. Um, but but um out of all the 12step programs, the only difference in any of them is the the first part of the first step and the middle part of the 12th step, what I'm powerless over and who I carry the message to.
And that's all driven by that that identification. First of all, I just want Do y'all see the coat and tie? And you know, I um it may not be important to y'all.
It's very important to every sponsor I've ever had that you get up behind the podium wearing a coat and tie. I may come out of it pretty soon, but um the bulk of my experience where I got to AA in a coat and tie, my job was to just stand there and say, "No contest, your honor." you know. So, I'm happy to be here, but I This collar is getting a little tight, honey.
I I uh I uh that's even um But, you know, talking about that identification, it's really something when it's not there. I mean, that's something. I was in a treatment center.
I went to a treatment center back in ' 83, and I'll never forget, I was there in the holidays. I checked in on December 8th of 83 and there was a we were getting ready to have our Christmas dinner. Now, I'm a big boy now, but I was about 35 lbs heavier when I checked into treatment.
And the reason I say that is it's Christmas Day and I was really interested in this Christmas dinner. I mean, they it was like the whole thing, turkey and dressing and cranberry sauce and mashed potatoes and gravy and rolls and and I swear to God, I'm just sitting down into my chair and the door swings open and in walks about five dogooders from one of the local churches and they've come to sing to us healing alcoholics. And uh you can imagine my excitement.
And uh and uh this I see them, they're coming around and this one woman is going along and she's talking. She she leans over, she says something to this guy. Then she leans over and says something to this lady and then she leans over, says something to this lady and this guy.
And I'm watching her and she gets to me and she says, "Are you a patient here?" And I said, "Yes, I am." She said, "I know exactly what you're going through." And I said, "Really?" She said, "I was once addicted to caffeine." And I was like, "Ain't that a bitch?" You know, I mean, did did you ever pawn your mom's sterling silver to buy a can of folders? You know, I mean, I mean, God bless her. She was trying to identify, but it just it wasn't there.
But, you know, that's that thing. But, back to my drinking. Uh, I was drinking I didn't drink.
It would be real macho to stand up here and say that I drank a bottle of whiskey every day from the time I was 16 until I checked, you know, in for the what I hope was the last time in the and in and when at the age of 28. That wouldn't be true. But what is true for Charlie Parker is that I never one time turned down the opportunity to get loaded under any circumstances for any reason.
Never one time. Never. Ever.
One time. There was never. Now, that's not everybody's story in AA.
A whole lot of people kept it together a lot better than I did. But for me, there was never one time where I went, "Oh, uh, gee, you know, it's my mom's birthday tomorrow." Um, you know, um, anything like that. It was just, "Let's go." And I, you know, and, um, and I I didn't know that, but, I did, but it started getting kind of sloppy.
And, um, because it worked pretty well for a while. I mean, you know, and and and then it started getting a little loose. And one night I left a bar in a blackout.
I was a blackout drinker. Uh Katie was not a blackout drinker. I was a blackout drinker.
I I blacked out regularly. I kind of thought that was the goal, you know. I But I left this bar in a blackout one night and I had five Long Island TE's and uh um there was a collision and uh I could see the fender.
I could only see about this big around and I could see a fender kind of up here and uh but I'm still rolling and I kept I drove around the corner and I had to grab my shoes for some reason and I ran back to the bar with my shoes in my hand. I don't know why my shoes were off but I was I was a lot of stuff was sketchy about that night. But I'm running back to the bar underneath this row of trees.
And as I run past the car that I'd hit, there's glass on the ground everywhere. And there's two cops standing there with a flashlight and they're shining it. And I remember seeing the glass tinkling on the and and I was just in my drunken state.
I remember thinking, "My god, they got here fast, you know? I mean, how did they get?" And so I run back and I reported the car stolen and and uh and and and this is not an extraordinary day. This is, you know, this is this is a day in the life of Charlie.
I mean, it could have been this is not a anything, but so I mean, it's my natural tendency to um Ford got a little squeak to it. Um um that's not me. That's Yeah.
Um, but I called the car and the next morning the police called me and they said, "Mr. Parker, you're going to have to I should I left out of the story." Katie thinks this is an important part of the story that it was my mother's car. Um, I was so poorly treated as a child that I finally ran away from home for good at the age of 28.
I mean, I'm serious. I'm not kidding. I never went back.
I mean, you know, it's a now I had some apartments and stuff during the time, but I but I was kept landing back and I wrecked every car my mother ever owned. And um and this was one of them. And uh this thing was called the Nerd Wagon.
It was fabulous. It was a we call it the Nerd Wagon because a little brown Fairmont station wagon with center cap hub rings. I mean, this thing the had a great stereo on it, but I don't like it could be 3:00 in the morning and you could you could have two hookers strapped to the hood and you wouldn't get pulled over.
I mean, you know, they would look at this station wagon and go, he suffered enough. You know, I mean, but but I I I go back and the next morning they go, "Mr. Parker, you're going to have to um you're going to have to come take a polygraph test before you pick your car up." I said, "Why is that?" They said, "Well, it was involved in a collision uh before it was reported stolen." I said, "You're kidding." And he said, "No.
Uh they ran into a they ran into a parked police car." And I remember thinking, "That explains how they got there so fast, you know? I mean, cuz I'd been fuzzy on that one." But I somewhere on page 24 in our book, it talks about it says at a certain point in the drinking of every alcoholic, he passes into a state where the most powerful desire to stop drinking is of absolutely no avail. I started losing the power of choice in drink.
The paragraph below that says, "The fact is that most alcoholics, for reasons yet obscure, have lost the power of choice in drink. Our so-called willpower becomes practically non-existent. I'm unable at certain times to call into my memory with call into my conscience with sufficient force.
The memory of the suffering and humiliation of a week or a month ago is without defense against the first drink. And I didn't know it. I had lost the power of choice and control and drink." And and the way I like to talk about I like I used to love pawn shops.
Um still kind of like them, but I mean I used to love pawn shops. I liked the whole equation of a pawn shop. I liked the whole deal because I was living kind of a shameful existence.
And I've never one time walked into a pawn broker and had him go, "Good God, man. What are you going to do with this money?" you know, or or uh or weren't you just in here this morning or, you know, or something like that. I mean, you just hand them the shotgun and and uh and then you go with the money and it's it's just like that.
Now, I should point out that I didn't own a lot of stuff. So, um I was having to pawn stuff that didn't belong to me and that creates a lot of hard feelings in your family and stuff. But, I mean, but I had a plan.
You know, we alcoholics make some kickass plans. I mean, we we really do. I mean, we make some we make plans that if you showed them to anybody, they'd go, "It's a pretty good plan, you know.
I mean, and you know, and and they work right up till they stop working, you know, and and the plan with this was you could pawn stuff and you had 90 days to do something to get everything out of the pawn shop and and then you could roll for a little while longer. you can kind of keep that cycle going and well till it stopped working. And now because by now I've lost the power of choice.
I came out of a 5-day blackout one day. I pulled an insurance scam and it was enough to get everything out of the pawn shop and I was just going to stop in and have a couple of drinks, you know, because I got a pocket full of money now. We got a full day of pawn shopping to do and and uh and and I just stopped in for a couple of drinks and next thing I knew I came out of a 5-day blackout.
Now, I didn't have many of those. I had a lot of overnight blackouts, but this was five days of just barely remembering anything. And um when I came out of the blackout, I had $8 in my pocket and I still had this big old roll of pawn tickets and hadn't gotten a darn thing out of the pawn shop.
And you know where it talks about emerging from a spree, emerging remorseful with a firm resolution not to drink again. I just remember, we've all had those mornings. I just remember sitting there going, "Oh no, oh no." You know, I mean, cuz I'd shot my wad getting everything out of the, you know, get pulling that one scam to get everything out.
And now I got nothing. And I would have to go to my father and my father was a good man and he worked hard for his stuff. Nobody was giving him his stuff.
And here's his little drunken son out pawning everything. And I would have to go to my dad and say, "Dad, if we act now, I can get you a pretty good deal on all of your stuff, you know, and and if there are any Alanons in the room, I apologize cuz I know that ain't right. I mean, I I was a sick boy, but I knew that that wasn't right.
And and I a lot of I have to tell it like a joke or I'll tear up during that. I should warn you in advance that I'm a Harley rider and all that stuff, but I'm not able to cry like a little girl in a pink dress up here at any moment. I mean, and I feel it when I get about a two second warning when it happens.
But um but uh I would have to go and and the thing about it was we we would get in the truck and it would be this was in Dallas. Dallas is a big spread out town and it was like we it wasn't just go to the pawn shop. It was we got to go over on Buckner Boulevard and get your shotgun.
We got to go over to East Grand and get the deer rifle and your your metal detectors over on Belt Line Road and and the coin collections in Oak Cliff and the sterling silver is Garland and you know so it was all day in the car with me and my dad and all that shame you know just and while we would be riding in the car while we'd be riding in the car I'd be going, "Dad, I swear to God, I will never do this again." And I meant if I was lying to that man, I damn sure didn't know it because I meant it with every fiber of my being that I will never do this again. I knew that was wrong. I knew I was hurting people.
What I didn't know was about lack of power. I didn't know that I didn't have the power to make good on that promise. When I was promising him that I was never going to do that again, I might as well have been promising him that I was going to flap my arms and fly around this room and come back and land behind the podium because I did not have the power to do it.
And I and I but it felt like I meant it. But within two days, I would hit the back door of his house like a cat burglar. And it was just come in and go that and off we'd go.
And before I got sober, my dad was an Allenon and I we had been done the rounds of the pawn shop three times before I got that was just the times when I couldn't pull it together to get everything out. That's how slick I was. That's how cool I was when I was drinking.
Um that's how much I had it together, you know, was a burden on my family and everybody that knew me or was or was unfortunate enough to love me. That's I like to point that out because, you know, there was a guy I was I do a lot of work out at this men's treatment center and there was a guy and he's getting ready to be released and I'll never forget it. He goes, you know, I mean, they told me when I got out I got to I got to get a sponsor and I got to do, you know, I got to make the meetings.
I got to do I said, "But I ain't going to do that stuff, man." He goes, "Cuz I'm I'm kind of slick, you know." He says, "Uh, I'm I got my own plan figured out." I went, "Hold up, hold up, hold up, pal." I said, "Just a minute." I said, "When you call me from a penthouse in Manhattan and you're partying with Donald Trump and the New York Giants cheerleaders and stuff, we'll talk about how slick you are." But when you check yourself into the Austin Recovery Center, you kind of cash in all your slick chips, you know? I mean, it's like they just go right into the middle of the table, you know? It's like we don't get here on a winning streak.
But but really I want to I want to blast through my early days in AA because really mine is a story of more like really what I was like what happened then what happened and what it's like now because I mine is a story of untreated alcoholism in the rooms of alcoholics anonymous to a great extent and that's that's the message I really like to talk about because I came to a in the early days in my early days and and I I worked the steps I kind of fancied myself as a big book thumper. I I I went to big book meetings. We had a big book meeting at the house.
Um I went to three Joe and Charlie big book studies, you know, and I mean and but I just I just missed a lot. And my beloved ex-sponsor Mark Houston used to say used to say, "How do you know what you don't know?" And uh I just missed an awful lot in my early days in sobriety. And um looking back on it, I didn't know it then, but I was working a program like the problem was alcohol.
I had come into AA and I was living as if my problem was alcohol. You know, I think it'd be news to a lot of people in the world and even a lot of people in AA that the problem with alcoholism is not alcohol. You know, if the problem is alcohol, you don't even belong here, you know.
Well, but I didn't know that. and and and and so what I did was I kind of worked the steps and but I was when I was operating on that basis that the problem was alcohol, it was kind of like you know that guy, the one that says, "Well, I screamed at my wife on the way out the door this morning. I slapped a couple of the kids and I was 2 hours late for work and looked at an hour and a half of internet porn at my cubicle and then left, you know, gambled a little bit on the internet, left work an hour and a half early and ate a half gallon of ice cream on the way home, but uh I didn't drink today and that makes me a winner, you know, and you're like, well, it kind of makes you a nimrod, you know, but uh I haven't always said Nimrod either.
try uh clean that up. But you know what had happened was the book takes a real turn on page 60 and I had missed it for a long time and uh and I was living life based on the problem being alcohol. On that basis on the basis of living life like my solution to it was that was that the problem was alcohol.
I was in constant collision with something or somebody in sobriety for a long time. And and I I hit the wall in sobriety. This probably doesn't happen in Florida, but it was it was rampant in Texas in the 80s.
I uh I hit the wall at about four and a half years sober and I pulled back and I took another run at it and I hit the wall again at about seven years. And then I just kind of coasted into a period of my sobriety that I like to call my flat period kind of. I was just it was just meeting based sobriety.
I mean, I was I was basically just a guy that was very very much about not drinking and I was very much about being an AA member. And I went to a meeting occasionally, but looking back on it, there wasn't a whole lot else going on. And you know what happened with me and the thing that I like to report is those bedments on page 52 where it talks about uh unable to control our emotional natures.
Uh um a lot of that stuff that all that stuff's available in sobriety and and I experienced it, you know, in sobriety. And um it's just back to that thing about how do you know what you don't know? I mean Katie's story is a lot the same.
We for her the good stuff in a in in recovery, the gifts of sobriety had kind of pulled her away from the fellowship. I had kind of hit the wall two or three times. I got to the point where I was like, you know, to hell with this.
I'm going to do it my way, you know. Um I I'm going to get what I need. And and really it was a it was a dark period in my sobriety.
And I got in a very dishonest marriage and and uh um had a lot of things going on. And um I don't have any idea how close I was to drinking, but I know that I was I know that I was going along. And one day I'd married this very wealthy woman and we had a a place out in the Hamptons on eastern Long Island and we had chartered a plane to fly from LaGuardia back into New York City.
And uh it's first time I ever chartered a plane in my life. and and we got up in the air and we're flying along and um all of a sudden it goes and all of a sudden we're in a glider and uh I put the headset on. I'm in the co-pilot seat and hey I hear them say you're cleared to Gabesi airport and they're looking there's a runway right there at 10:00 and he we're not going to make it.
I mean he says you don't understand we we've lost engine power. I can't make land. I'm going to have to ditch.
And I remember going, "What?" You know, I'm a gambler. I'm a a lifelong gambler. What are the odds that the first time you ever charter a plane, it's going to go in the drink?
You know, I mean, that's like winning the lottery. But but we bring it down and uh we're coasting in for a landing and I'll never forget it. You know, we're coming in and he's he's turning in.
Fortunately, it had retractable landing gear, so it had a smooth belly. But he brings it in. I'll never forget he at one point he goes, "Brace for impact." And we're like uh pardon me.
Um how exactly do you do that? You know, uh you know, but but we bring it in and it's like splash down at Six Flags times a thousand, you know, water and spray and noise and all of a sudden complete silence. And I remember thinking, my god, we landed this thing.
Well, this wasn't much of an airplane, but it was a really crappy boat. And and uh about about the time I realized we were going to be okay, I felt something climbing up my legs and it just went and I mean and by the time I went up to get a breath of air, there was nothing but water in the roof of the plane. And I remember thinking, "So that's it.
I die in this stupid airplane, you know, and uh the door wouldn't come open. And then finally it came open and we all got out. There were five adults.
We got out, you know, Anderson Cooper interviewed us on CNN and all this stuff. But I mean, we came very, very close to drowning and everybody survived. Everybody but my dog.
The dog was with us and the dog didn't make it. But um but all the people got out and uh you know an event like that will change the way you look at things you know and and uh for for a few days I was just really really grateful really grateful they you know how you doing? Oh, I'm doing good, you know, and and then I started getting kind of angry, you know, and I started getting a little angry and I I mean, and but I went to John Henry, this guy in Austin, and I just remember going to him saying, "John Henry, now Katie was my best friend at this point, but she may have helped point this out to me because she's always been very generous with her input with me." And uh but I remember going to John Henry and going, "John Henry, I'm so self-centered.
I can't even be involved in a conversation with anybody, you know. I mean, I just have to force myself to go, how are the kids, you know, and and act like I give a flip about the answer because I don't. I mean I you know I'm self and and and you know one of the biggest mistakes that I see if if there's any mistakes being made one of the biggest mistakes I see in a these days is taking somebody we're good at the first step but taking somebody from the second step and are you willing to believe and that there might be a power and if the guy says yes popping him down on his knees and doing the third step prayer and and rolling into the fourth step then because that was my experience that's what happened to me was my sponsor took me my first and I love Jim and and you know I'll never say anything bad about him.
He was transmitting what was transmitted to him. But and I might not have even done what but the way it happened was we went right from are you willing to believe to doing a third step prayer and rolled right into the inventory process. Well, the only thing that happens as a result.
You don't miss much except for this body of work between pages 60 and 63. And all it describes is the root of our problem. It's it's the entire basis of the rest of the work and the root of my problem.
and and it says I'll never forget it going back through the book with Mark and these guys I started you know doing work with these big book thumpers and and uh I remember reading along and there was a thing and it said um you know after the ABC that we're reading every meeting you know see that God couldn't you saw everybody started chanting that in the past few years I mean well give me just a second but you don't have to do that you know uh that's not aa all that chanting crap that came in from the treatment centers over there. Optional, optional. That's all I'm going to say about it.
You don't have, you know, I mean, my god, when I got here, it was like, keep coming back. And then it was, keep coming back, it works. And it's keep coming back, it works.
If you work it and you're worth it, so work it, you know, and after a while I'm just like, you know, and now they're chanting everything. It just drives me out of my mind. I always think about the newcomer coming in, you know, and we're chanting like a bunch of kids at summer camp, you know.
It's like, God, I want to stop drinking, but do I really have to do all this? you know, I mean, you know, but I digress. Um, of course, you know me, I judge no man.
Uh, but but on page 60 there, you know, right after that, AB, and C, the next line says, "Being convinced, we were at step three." And it goes into, you know, turning our will and our life over the care of God. when I talk about the book taking a big right turn on page 60 right there in that next paragraph because it's the book has promised me clear-cut directions and it says just what do we mean by that and just what do we do because when you're saying turn my will and my life over the care of God it's kind of nebulous a little bit but I mean what are you talking about and what do we do and it said in the next line I'll never forget it you ever I work with the set aside prayer a lot with the guys that I work with and we do a little prayer before we read the book or before we do the work that goes something like God help me set aside everything I think I know about this book about the steps about the program and even you God help me so that I can have an open mind and a new experience help me see the truth something like that not saying throw your old beliefs away just set them aside see if there might be something because sometimes for me what I think I know can stand in the way of the truth you know and I like I don't know about you guys but I like to read and look for things that I agree with anybody any you know I mean and so when I'm doing like that I'm not going to see any new information because I'm just looking for ways that I'm already right you know I'm looking through the book I'm going yeah oh yeah oh yeah uhhuh yeah oh oh see you can't tell me anything about that I've already got that underlined and highlighted you know I mean you know and but but I mean I'm reading that that day and I'll never forget it we're talking about step three and it says the first requirement is that I be convinced that any life run on self-will can hardly be a success. That's got to be fourth edition stuff.
You know, I mean, cuz I remember looking at that and going, not only have I never been convinced of that, that line never touched me. That line never had any kind of an impact on me. the the the being convinced that my life run any life run on self-will.
So what happened is instead of a life based on abstinence, I started working a program based on self-will. You know, it goes on, it talks about the actor trying to run the whole show on it. Talks about, you know, what usually happens.
this doesn't go the way I you know he talks about my little toolkit of self-will where I I'll be nice or I'll be overbearing or whatever it takes for me to get my way but but it's usually doesn't go over and then the delusion there's two things key parts in that when you're sponsoring somebody the reason I can't see self-centerness in myself is because one it says even though my motives are good right there at the bottom page 60 and at the top it talks about this delusion where if only people would do as I wish if only people would do as I Hey, life would be wonderful. Everybody would be pleased. Not just me.
All you people would be pleased too if you just But I just can't get y'all to act right, you know. But but if if everybody would. Well, how can that be selfish if I'm trying to create utopia out here for everybody, you know?
I mean, and then you to filter. Well, so then it goes into it doesn't go very well. I start feeling like I'm not being treated right.
I become angry, indignant, self-pity. I start thinking life doesn't treat me right and then and then you know and by the time the self-pity is always the last days and that's the one where I finally get to the point where I go what's the use anyway you know I am a genius surrounded by jackasses you know and and you know and and I roll on well it goes on and it says on the next page it says um I'm glad I got Mark Houston out of the way because I I've been having a real hard I haven't gotten through a talk yet where I could say his name but Um the guy changed my life and uh we started doing workshops and stuff with him and you know and it was like I cuz remember Katie and I wandered into a workshop with him one time and I remember sitting there going my god man what book are you reading from? You know I mean he was he was talking about stuff at a level that I had never experienced it before.
And when we get over on that page 62 where it says selfishness and self-centeredness that we think is the root of our problem and then you go down a little further and it says above everything we got to be rid of this selfishness and Mark used to look you dead in the eye and go what does above everything mean to you? It doesn't say above everything I got to be rid of fear. Doesn't it doesn't even say above everything I got to stop drinking vodka.
It says above everything, I got to get rid of this selfishness or I or it'll kill me. Well, it turns out that alcohol never was my problem. Alcohol was the it was my solution.
It was the only thing I'd ever found that would treat the pain of a life based completely on selfishness and self-centerness. And you know, Mark used to say selfish and self-centered. Most newcomers when you say that, when you say selfish and self-centered, they think we mean stingy and conceited, you know, you know, and I'm like, I'm not stingy.
I'll share a jug with somebody, you know. I mean, you know, that sort of thing. But, um, it doesn't mean that I think too little of myself or too much of myself.
I just think about me too much. I know y'all can't relate to that, you know? I mean, but I mean, I got me on me like, you know, like Bob D says, like that monster from Alien, you know, where I mean, you know, and I I could tell story after story and God knows Katie could too.
I mean, but you know, the way but the thing about self when you start looking for self and manifestations of self and you know the first place it becomes obvious is in y'all. You know, I can't see self in myself. I am blind to my own self-centerness.
That's why I got to have a sponsor. Now I can see it in you guys, you know. I mean, there was there was a guy out in the hall a little earlier.
I had it all over him, you know. I mean, but but I got to have accountability. I got to have a sponsor that's going to point out to me.
And I got to have a sponsor that's constantly taking it back to how did you set the ball rolling? What was your role in it? How did you make decisions based on self that placed you in a position to be harmed?
You know, because if I got a sponsor, if I call in a sponsor and I'm bitching about Katie and he starts talking about Katie, I'm dead. I'm I'm dead. I gotta have somebody that's taking me back to my piece of it.
And you know, we started work, you know, but this thing about the selfishness. It turns out that that whole period in the program, I'd been looking at the wrong problem, you know, and Chuck Chamberlain used to tell a story about a guy that had been afraid of dogs his whole life. and and it's in it's in new pair of glasses.
And he he said all his life he'd run from dogs and and and when he was doing inventory, he remembered that when he was a kid, this neighborhood dog had bit him. And but when he inventoried it a little further, he remembered that he'd been chasing one of little neighborhood girls across her yard when her dog had come out and bit him. And he said, "All my life, I'd been running from dogs and chasing women, and dogs never were my problem." You know, I mean, that's the way it had been for me with alcohol and alcoholism.
I'm I'm living like like Well, now when you start living a program based on reduction of self, we got a whole new ball game. It is a game changer. And I lines in the book that I don't know what I used to do when I would see him.
I'm serious. I mean, I'm not a dumb guy, you know? I would read that stuff and I just I don't know.
I guess it just went right over my head. But man, now when I start looking at the self is just it's all over the work. And you know, and even when you get into four step, it says, "What did I do when I heard this on?" It says, "Being convinced that self manifested or showing up in various ways was what had defeated me.
Am I convinced that self is what defeated me?" We look for its common manifestations. So the fourstep inventory is really just a consideration of manifestations of self. If you're telling me self is the problem, how does it show up?
What does it look like? I don't understand when you say self and the book goes, well, resentment is the number one offender. It kills more alcoholics than anything else as a manifestation of self.
And then we start looking at resentment and all the way that self is entered into that equation. If I got a good sponsor, my first fourth step didn't even have a fourth column in it. In this one now, it's all about taking those manifestations of self and showing me in the fourth column where the second column is a liar.
You know, by the time I get done doing my fourth column, my resentment, the reason I'm resentful in the second column, turns out I need to go back and make amends to them. That sucks, you know, but I mean, you know, there's a lot of growth that takes in player. And you know, the other thing, there's a lot of power in that inventory process, but there's real power in the prayers and the force.
I have never seen one fourstep guide anywhere that mentioned the sick man prayer at the bottom of page 66. And that is a mighty powerful piece of work between the third column and the fourth column where I go, we realize that these people who wronged us were perhaps spiritually sick. I'm going to tell a little story about Roy there.
He told me I could tell this story. I was sponsoring a guy and he had been mad at his dad for 42 years. His father had come home.
His mother was a little wacky and his father had come home one day and he had a brother and sister and his father had come home one day and said, "Your mother killed herself today and walked on in the house." Roy had been pissed his whole adult life that how insensitive that was to just walk across the yard, say, "Your mom killed herself and walk on in the house." And so that was column one. Column two, you know, insensitive. Didn't think about my feelings.
Just drop that on me. That sort of thing. How did it affect me?
Oh boy, let's talk about that. You know, and then when we get in the fourth column or when we do that sick man prayer between the two, I go, um, it says we realize that these people were half spiritually sick. I said, did it ever occur to you that your dad had been married to a mentally ill woman for for a good while now, and that she had tried to kill herself several times before, and then on this day, she'd been successful.
And now he's in a small town in Texas. He's got to figure out how to tell everybody they know that they're planning a funeral. He's got to figure out how he's going to raise three kids and keep a job.
And he's got to, you know, he's got a lot of stuff on his mind. And he's, is it possible that he was doing the best he could when he walked past you and said, "Your mom killed herself today." He said, like any of us would, "It never occurred to me for a second." Never occurred to me for a second. All of my memories of my childhood are about me.
I don't have any memories of the struggles my parents went through or anything like that. It's me, me, me, me, me. And I I watched Roy do that prayer and we did the fourth column and I watched a 42-year-old resentment dissolve in my sun room that afternoon.
I mean, that's the power of this work when you're properly armed with the facts about yourself and you can and have something, you know, to really carry. It was it was unbelievable. Well, I get back into the work with a new level of surrender and I started hanging out with these guys, you know, um, a friend of mine went to treatment, met this oneeyed guy from Kurbell, Texas, that some of you may know and Chris R from Texas and and and I I started driving around listening to some of those CDs and I'm I'm real grateful to these tapers because a whole lot of the growth that's come in my sobriety has come from driving around listening to CDs of speaker tapes.
And if there's nobody here taping them, we just get to listen to each other, you know, and um and or listen to myself is even worse. But I mean, I love the tapers and I love if you if you're getting into this deal, I recommend getting some recommendations of these tapes and drive around and listen to them. I mean, it's it's it's better than talk radio, you know, and but but what happens is we hooked up with Mark Houston at at a workshop.
I'll never forget it. I'll never forget it. I mean, the first day we were there, it was just like I said, it was like I was just so tuned in with this guy and everything he said, I was just completely plugged in and I and was just we're just going, "Oh my god." You know, and uh I'll never forget he called this little guy up there, this guy named Paul, cute little guy that was out in the audience.
And you know, it was a three-day workshop. So, we're there and he gets him up there and he goes, "Paul, let me ask you a question." He goes, "Do you meditate?" He goes, "Well, I'm a truck driver." See, and uh sometimes I meditate when I'm driving the truck and Mark goes, "Two things, Paul. Um first of all, when you're driving the truck, we want you to be about driving the truck, you know." He's like, "We don't need you hurtling down the road in a tractor trailer meditating, you know." and and he goes second of all in the future.
I'm sorry. In the future, when I ask you a yes or no question, I'm going to expect a yes or no response. So, I'm going to ask you again if you meditate, and it's very important to me for you to say no.
you know, and that was my first experience with Mark. And Katie and I were both sitting there going, "Praise God he didn't call us up there." You know, I mean, cuz wow. Well, we're taking a new work at the book.
We're looking at the set aside prayer. I had a completely new experience with step three. I'm starting to look at the work now as as reduction of self.
I see this new deal. You know, the deal in step three fully and completely is that is that I'm out of the God business and you know and he's going to be the father, I'm the children, he's the principal of the company. I'm his agent.
Um he's the director. I'm just an actor now. But then it goes on and then the the terms of the deal.
The book at one point says God doesn't make too hard a terms for those that seek him. The terms of the deal are at the top of that 63 where it says being all powerful he provided what we needed under two conditions if I stay close to him and perform his work well. The whole terms of the deal God will take care of my needs if I'll just stay close to him and perform his work well.
And I started actually what you know taking that inside and really living you know the that as the basis of my life and I mean things started changing. I did another inventory with these guys and and what happened as a result of having this powerful fourth column and having somebody really pointing out my part in all this stuff and I'm seeing it over and over and over again. selfish, dishonest, inconsiderate, frightened, you know, and how that shows up for a guy like me.
And on this occasion when because the first time I did step six and seven, did anybody else have this experience where it was like you could just kind of phone that one in, you know? I mean, just two little paragraphs in the book, you know? I mean, my six and seven the first time.
This time I had real stuff to take into six and seven that was fresh in my mind from this inventory we just done. and it just been hammered into me over and over and over again of all the way self was showing up in my life and I had this new experience with step six and seven. We get together one time and he says we're going to have a meeting and he says I thought well we'll get together we'll probably write inventory again.
God knows, you know, when you start working with a new guy, they always want to write inventory, you know. I mean, don't we like to write inventory, you know, cuz it's it feels like I'm doing some pretty solid AA, but it I'm still talking about my favorite subject, you know, which is me, you know, you know, but Mark says, "Let's have a look at steps eight and nine. Where are you guys at with steps eight and nine?" Well, I might have one or two or 42 unfinished amends.
And you know, and and we started looking at the amends process like it really had something to do with whether or not I drink again or with whether or not I'm going to feel those bedments in sobriety. And I'll never The most powerful AA I've ever been involved in takes place at my kitchen table on Thursday nights. And we've been doing it for years.
Mark came every Thursday night. We're still doing it now. But one of the exercises we did was we all said, "Let's all go home." because everybody at the table had unfinished amends, you know, and what happens for a guy like me is I make up my amends list in the eighth step and I'll make the the first ones that the hurricane the little tornado that's my life touches.
I'll make those, but somehow that list finds its way into a drawer and I you know, it says we're going to be amazed before we're halfway through. Well, I was. And uh and you know, and so now we're talking about making all of those amends.
And but the thing that was amazing was we said for our exercise this week, I want everybody to go home and write out your men's list and we're going to meet next Thursday and we're all going to read our men's list together. There's about 14 men, me and the guys that I sponsor at the time. And it was so powerful because I mean having all these people and the other thing I can tell you is you better keep your pencil handy because what would happen is you know we'd be sitting there and you know okay you go and and then you go well I ran out of some restaurants without paying and you're like oh well let me write that one down you know and and you know bought gas and drove off without uh paying for it.
and you're like, "Huh, wow. Okay, I didn't have that one down either." And you know, and and it was just over and you know, so the list gets longer and then we make out cards. We work with the men's cards where instead of just having it on a list, we write it on a little 3×5 card and it has the the name of the person, the the nature of the harm, their contact information, and then down at the bottom, we'll put two things.
How can I make this right? And the last question is, have I harmed you in any other way? Because when you're as self-centered as I am, part of living a life based completely on self is I have almost no conception of my effect on the people around me.
But, you know, I always think my motives are sterling and and I'm trying to create utopia for everybody. And you look up and people are pissed and you're like, "What?" You know, so I might go to my sister and say, "Uh, I'd like to make amends to you for stealing $15 out of your purse." And and she'd go, "That's how you think you harmed me? you know, that's not even in the top 15, you know, and and so we started doing this.
Now, I believe this can be taken too far. Uh because my beloved wife Katie here, I went to make amends to her and I said, "Uh, like the good little AA I was becoming." I said, "Now, honey, um, if you need some time to consider other ways that I've harmed you and you want to come back to me and talk about this later, I'd like to give you that opportunity and and we'll talk about it, you know, later." She said, "Okay, well, sounds pretty good, doesn't it?" Yeah. Well, we're sitting there at the breakfast table and I mean and and I mean she we're talking about something I said something stupid that I've done in the past and she goes, "Oh, that's on the list." And I go, "What list is that?" And she goes, "You told me I could go make a IO who you know that had like a one week statute of limitations on it.
I mean, I didn't mean carry a pad in your back pocket and every time something occurs to you, put it, you know. Oh, and there is one other thing, you know, but she told me she just put something on it this week, you know, but but I think she's about ready to read it to me. You know, we started doing steps 10 and 11 really doing them, you know, uh going through the day continuing to watch for selfishness, dishonesty, resentment, fear, and you know, calling somebody, asking God to remove it, making amends for it, turn my attention to somebody I could help, and actually getting up in the morning and thinking about the 24 hours ahead, and really doing this, you know, this stuff at a level.
It's amazing. If you're looking for instruction, just read pages 84 to 88 every morning. And there's a hell of a lot of good instruction there that'll get you going.
But we really started doing it like every day. And it it's been the the results of it have been unbelievable. I mean, before I get to acting like I'm doing this deal perfectly, though.
Um, I got to tell you, I mean, I'm still just a drunk out here trying to do the best I can. You know, that's why we have a 10th step. And that's why, you know, and I still am capable of doing some stupid stuff.
And one day, I was talking about the Austin Recovery Center earlier. I was given a chip to a newcomer. I mean, not a newcomer, a sponsy that was picking up like a three-year chip, I think, and and I'd been at Austin Recovery at their big meeting on Sunday night, and it's Monday, and I'm at the Sprint store the next day.
Has Sprint made anybody else's inventory? You know, I mean, they've made every inventory I've ever written, you know, and uh and uh I'm in there and at one point I find myself rolled up on my knuckles like a gorilla. hollering at this guy, this poor guy behind the counter, you know, about screwing up the deal.
And he goes off to take care of my little phone problem. And I look over and this guy standing right over here and he's grinning at me kind of funny. And I go, "Man, they're getting me a little worked up." And he goes, "Did you see me get my 90-day chip last night?" And I'm Mr.
22 years, you know, standing there and and uh I go, you know, pal, uh um what you just saw there was not the principles of our program in action, you know, and and if you'll stick around for just a few more minutes, you'll get to see what an active 10th step looks like. Mr. Aa, right?
you know, but but uh you know, all that stuff prepares me. And what you know, what it's trying to do is if my lack of power is my problem and my only solution is this power. Steps four through nine and 10, four through nine are about removing what's blocking me from that power.
Getting all that stuff out of the way so there at least can be enough contact that I can hear God talking to me. When you get into those 11 step, when it says pause when agitated or doubtful, ask for the right thought or action, those are promises. Those are promises that come as a result of doing the work out of the book.
Because believe me, if I'm blocked, I ain't pausing for one thing, and God could be sitting next to me with a bullhorn and I can't hear him if I'm blocked. My job in all this work is to try to remain unblocked enough that some of that intuitive stuff that comes from God that starts to promise us in the 10th step and the 11th step and you know can get through and you know as a result of that though you wind up with a real message to carry you know to the new guy and that's been the biggest step 12 is the real magic of the whole deal. I mean, the whole all that stuff is getting us ready for step 12.
And if you're not sponsoring anybody, you're jipping yourself out of the real magic of Alcoholics Anonymous besides it being a duty to carry that message like it was carried to me. when I don't know when sponsorship became optional but you know a friend of friend of mine likes to say that you know we used to be a a recovery program with a support fellowship and now we've kind of turned into a recovery fellowship with an optional program you know and working this program at a high level you don't have to force that guy into service work you can't keep that guy from carrying this message when somebody's had their ass lit on fire by the power that comes as as a result of doing this work. You don't have to browbeat that guy into service work.
I mean, he's out there dying to carry that message. And if you're not, you know, one of the things in and uh Price and I were talking about this earlier today about rather than having somebody ask to be my sponsor, it's perfectly okay to go up to me and go, "You're going to need a sponsor. Um that's somebody that tells you what we do around here and and I'd be happy to do it." And I mean, the newcomer doesn't know any better.
And besides that, it's way too important of a decision to leave up to the new guy, you know? I mean, this guy can't find the water fountain and we're going to let him we're going to let him come in and choose a sponsor, you know. I'm looking for somebody I can relate to, you know, and so what does that mean?
Another plumber, you know, or you know, you need somebody that can show you how to do this work out of the book. And I've had some amazing stories come out of walking up to guys and I love Katie came up with one where she said if you're not if you can't find anybody to work with and you're sitting around the room because there's a lot of people dying of untreated alcoholism in the rooms of Alcoholics Anonymous. I mean and if you you look around and when we're all laughing in a meeting or you'll be in a meeting everybody's cracking up and stuff while everybody's cracking up take a second look around.
Not everybody's laughing. There's people sitting in there that don't think this is a damn bit funny. And that's the guy to go up to afterwards and go, "How you doing?" You know, how how's things going for you?
Because I'm I was dying of untreated alcoholism well into well into this deal. and and to if you had come to me at 17 years sober and told me what was going to change my life and light me on fire was the program of Alcoholics Anonymous right out of the big book Alcoholics. I would have told you you're full of beans because I've been doing AA for 17 years.
I know what AA brings me and it's it's like I assume we're all Dallas Cowboy fans here. Is that right? Uh yeah.
Um, I'm a Dallas Cowboy fan and uh I've spent my whole life going to Cowboys games and one day there was this I mean I've been a fan since they were good, you know, and and uh I'm sponsoring this guy one time and he says, "Hey, how would you like to go to the Cowboy game uh in the skybox? My family's got a skybox. Do you want to go to the Eagles game?" I went, "Absolutely." and and we drive up to Dallas and we park in this private little parking lot and we go up a private go in a private entrance and you go up this quiet little escalator and it's all civilized and go down this little hallway and you go into the skybox and they're bringing in trays of cookies and buckets of ice and stuff and I didn't know whether to be excited about being there or to be pissed off about sitting in the cheap seats for 20 years, you know, but that's been that was my experience with alcohol.
olics synonyonymous. If I'd have died in that plane crash, I would have missed it. If I, you know, I would have thought that I had experienced what Alcoholics Anonymous had to offer.
I think there's plenty of the message of the hope of recovery out there for the new guy coming into. I think there's plenty of message in almost every meeting that the new guy can get and stay sober. But I'm talking to the guy that's been in the rooms for a while.
I'm talking about the guy with three years, five years, 15 years, 22 years that's not feeling it and not getting it and not um experiencing what you hear some people describe from these podiums. I'm here to tell you that it's still available and it's available as a result of the work out of the big book of Alcoholics Anonymous. Just you get a new beginning.
You don't have to relapse to turn this deal around. You know, I've had guys Katie was speaking in Oklahoma and this guy came up to me and he he goes, "I'm not doing well at all." And we started talking. He was 16 years sober and thinking about killing himself.
He said, "I'm not really thinking about drinking, but I think about killing myself a lot." And we've been going back through the work and this guy is on fire. I mean, it's a it's it that is the real magic, you know, to get to see something like that. I mean, that'll get you out of bed in the morning, you know.
This is, you know, and I'll never forget it. We sat down and we talked about it. I said, "Well, uh, you know, how long since you wrote inventory?" Well, 16 years.
You know, where you at with the amends process? Well, they're all still there, you know. Do you do you do prayer and meditation on a on a regular basis?
No. Um, I said, "This is all good news, you know, cuz if you were doing all that stuff and thinking about offing yourself, we'd have to get really creative, you know, but we got something for this, you know. Um this this one we got, you know, um so I mean that's that's the thing.
But you know, we got the three-sided triangle that used to be the symbol of AA. It really burns me up that they took it out, but I I don't have any. But it talks about unity, service, recovery.
All I was doing was unity. And I was doing working one side of the triangle, hoping for the results of all three sides of the triangle, you know. But when you're doing unity which is the fellowship and what we're doing tonight uh service which is out there you know doing whatever form of service work you get involved and then recovery the base of it being working the 12 stratus of program that's when it creates a foundation for life that is unshakable and and you know that's what I'm doing but think the thing I was going to say is we come to these conferences sometimes we come to these conferences and maybe we're not doing real good you know I need a little charge or I need a little I need a little picking And and I get to these conferences, I get all charged up and I get real excited about, you know, the solution is there and I get right up next to the solution.
And then what happens is I go back to my house and I fall back into my life and, you know, next it's the family problem and it's the kids and it's the work and it's the money and and I get right up next to the solution and I fall back away from it. Get in there and do the work. You know, it's uh it's just what if we were all really really working an AA program at a high level, how much better would our lives be?
You know what? If we were really, you know, practicing these principles in all my affairs, carrying a vision of God's will into every day, you know, constant thought of others, pause when agitated or doubtful, ask for the right thought or action, constantly reminding ourselves that we're no longer running the show, saying to ourselves many times, even a couple of times each day, each, thy will, not mine, be done. How much better off would we be?
I mean, it's just it's it's amazing to think about, but you know, as far as life goes today, and I'm going to shut up real soon. I have never been happier in my life. I got a new sponsor.
Um, I miss my old sponsor, but it took me a few months to get a sponsor. And even Bob Daryl, my buddy from Vegas, he was like, "Charlie, I love you, but God, man, you need a sponsor, you know, I got I got to have it, you know." And so, I got hooked up with Larry Jay from Dallas, and it's been a really good deal. But, you know, not only that, Katie and I are up are just on fire with the program of Alcoholics Anonymous and you know, and the the talks we have in the mornings and you know, most of a lot of it revolves around sponsorship and what do you do when they say this and what do you when you run up against that?
And she probably sponsors what 25 girls and I'm sponsoring about 15 guys and um she has a meeting at the house on Monday nights. I have a meeting at the house on Thursday nights. One of the things that really pisses her off is if you say there's not enough strong women in AA.
I mean, don't step back if you say that to her. Um and so you know so she started having a workshop on Monday nights once a month showing women how to sponsor people through the steps and 45 I'll come home and 4550 women there in the living room talking about step one in January talking about step two and and I mean these and you see we started this group the primary purpose group and four and a half years later we got 175 people meeting on Tuesday nights talking about the big book and and the getting that solution and carrying that solution out into the community and the ripple effect of that. Mark Houston said it one day where he said, "Look what happened when you two guys came to that workshop.
Look at the ripple effect that's happened to that in the AA community. It's just it's been a mind-blowing thing to be a part of." You know, the book says the best years of our existence lie ahead of us. It doesn't say things kind of taper off at 25 years and then, you know, starts to suck a little bit more every year.
I mean, this deal is it's magic and it keeps getting better and better and better and I really believe that the best years of our existence lie ahead of us. How am I doing? I got five minutes.
I used to hear people say that Alcoholics Anonymous saved my life and I thought they meant it kept me from dying. One day I was driving by this penitentiary where the guy that I ran with every day was in penitentiary for the fifth time since I'd been sober. And I remember think and I was looking at that and I was thinking about your my life being the period of time that I spent on this planet and I was thinking about the effects that drugs and alcohol had had on Rex's life.
You know, here he sits in the penitentiary doing 35 years and how Alcoholics Anonymous had plucked me out of that and given me the opportunity to have a life and to have children and to have a business and to have friends that I love and that love me and to have the kind of relationship I have today. It gave a whole new meaning to Alcoholics Anonymous saved my life. So when I say Alcoholics Anonymous saved my life, I'm not kidding because I was heading nowhere.
On page 100, it says, "Both you and the new man must walk day by day in the path of spiritual progress. If you persist, remarkable things will happen. When we look back, we realize that the things which came to us when we put ourselves in God's hands were better than anything we could have planned." I'd been reading this at the end of meetings for a long time before I saw that piece that says when we look back we see that the things that came to us when we put ourselves in God's hands were better than anything we could have planned.
Cuz going into it, I don't know about you guys, but it always looks like God's will is going to jip me a little bit. You know, I always think I can get over on God just a little bit. But then I look back when I really go all in on this deal.
You look back a year or two later and you go, "My God, look at the things that came to me when I really did this deal the whole way." So this is better than anything I could have planned. Follow the dictates of a higher power and you'll presently live in a new and wonderful world. No matter what your present circumstances, I want to thank you for having us.
I'm really looking forward to the rest of the conference and uh we'll be around all weekend. I'd love to talk to any of you guys. Thanks for having me.
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